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View Full Version : Express elevator to hell!! GOING DOWN!!



Spanklet
08-25-2009, 09:33 AM
1500 Deep strike themed list:

I feel deep striking peace-meal will get you killed most of the time.

Even if you plan it well you probably will only get half your force on the enemy's side of the board considering the 50% chance turn 2 reserve entry and those 9 rail TL rail guns the Tau (just an example) broadside groups pack will insta pop your 1st turn dreads.

With all the 9/10 strength weapons out there killing regular termies like they are nothing I had to come up with some tweaking to overcome that stuff.

So I created an army that can control objectives yet land about 80-90% of your force (simultaneously) on turn 2.

Using this method overcomes the problem of dropped forces not getting on top of the enemy in large enough numbers fast enough.

Most armies can seriously hamper an assault shock force dropped all over them if it comes in piece-meal. The only way to keep the 90% reserve force usefull was to make sure most of it entered together. To accomplish this I made Tigurius the HQ, doubling the success rate of reserve entry. He has other bonuses such as being able to cast all possible psy attacks and can use 3 a turn. Unfortunatley it appears that he cannot use termie armor / storm shield like the regular librarians so he will initially deploy with the Sternguard.

Extra Info:
A. Normally I would have put Lysander with 8 or 9 regular termies using storm bolters or a termie librarian with asslt termies but I cant afford Lysander since Tigurius was key to making the deep strike work.
B. All units deep striking except for the two sniper scout groups (outflankers).
C. The Sternguard will split into two squads upon deployment.
D. The Asslt termies and the Sternguard will attempt to be within 24" of eachother at deployment so Tigurius can join the asslt termies as soon as possible (3+ inv saves) and warp them around to fights if needed. It also takes fire off the much easier to kill Sternguard that he dropped in with. If the Sternguard are not getting pounded too hard he should stay with them.
E. TAC squad will be forced to drop turn 1 and will try to stay out of sight on my side of the board, emerging on turn 2 when main contingent lands. Primary job is objective holding and shooting as much of the enemy as possible before the run on objectives (if any) starts. Same applies to the scouts.
F. Too many insta pop weapons out there to make your regular termies die too quick but asslt get the 3+ invul save making them an excellent fire soaker. Preserving the Sternguards and Tigurius is of the higest priority so moving him to the termies will pull fire off SG and prolong the life of your HQ vastly.
G.Your Sternguards are going to be on the enemies sh** list right away so tie up his/her forces as fast as possible.
H. Army based on SM Codex

HQ:
Chief Librarian Tigurius 230 pts
(Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Hood of Hellfire; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Rod of Tigurius; Force Dome; Machine Curse; Might of the Ancients; Null Zone; Quickening; Smite; The Avenger; The Gate of Infinity; Vortex of Doom)

ELITE:
Terminator Assault Squad 200 pts
4 Terminator Assault Squad (Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield x4
1 Sergeant (Thunder Hammer & Storm Shield x1)

Sternguard Veteran Squad 295 pts
9 Sternguard Veteran Squad (Bolt Pistol x9; Bolter x3; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Special Issue Ammunition; Combi-Meltagun x2)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Bolter; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Special Issue Ammunition)
1 Drop Pod (Storm Bolter)

TROOPS:
Tactical Squad 205 pts
9 Tactical Squad (Bolt Pistol x9; Bolter x7; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Flamer; Multi-Melta)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Bolter; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades)
1 Drop Pod (Storm Bolter)

Scout Squad 75 pts
4 Scout Squad (Bolt Pistol x4; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Scout Armour; Sniper Rifle x4)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Scout Armour; Sniper Rifle)

Scout Squad 75 pts
4 Scout Squad (Bolt Pistol x4; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Scout Armour; Sniper Rifle x4)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Scout Armour; Sniper Rifle)

FAST ATTACK:
Assault Squad 140 pts
4 Assault Squad (Bolt Pistol x4; Chainsword x4; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Flamer)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Melta Bombs; Power Fist)

Assault Squad 140 pts
4 Assault Squad (Bolt Pistol x4; Chainsword x4; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Flamer)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Melta Bombs; Power Fist)

Assault Squad 140 pts
4 Assault Squad (Bolt Pistol x4; Chainsword x4; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Flamer)
1 Sergeant (Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Jump Packs; Krak Grenades; Power Armour; Melta Bombs; Power Fist)

Anyway this list is still evolving as time goes on so any input is always welcome.

ThePov
08-25-2009, 03:10 PM
Well, the problem I see is that you really don't have too much that can drop first turn and screw the enemy up. You have only two drop pods, which means that only one can drop on the first turn, and one MUST drop first turn, which I assume will be the Sterns. Sterns are great, don't get me wrong, but they'll be the only thing on the board, and they'll get chewed to pieces. No matter how good a single unit is, it will die if an entire army is firing on it. Personally, I'd cut the sterns down to 5, drop one of the assault squads, and drop the scout squads for another Tac squad, and invest in a Dread of some kind. You'll then have 4 drop pods, so two will come in first turn, and they'll likely be able to do a good bit more damage-dealing and confusion-sowwing than the sterns alone.

Also, Locator beacons on the drop pods and more Meltas (combis in the Sterngaurd squad are good, but why stop at two? There's no limit, you need the melta, it's a cheap upgrade, and you can still use special ammo, so their's really no downside). The First will help keep you from losing half of your otherwise unkillable (almost) Termies because they're waste deep in a rock, and the second will allow you to deal with Mech armies, which you have almost no provisions for ATM.

Spanklet
08-25-2009, 06:41 PM
Thanks for the review!! Only thing is:

"So I created an army that can control objectives yet land about 80-90% of your force on the enemy turn 2"

Its designed to only have the TAC on turn 1. The Chief Librarian was chosen to make sure most the force lands together on the 2nd turn. If Tigurius is in your army list any reserve entry failures are re-rolled.

Id argree with the melta issue tho. I was trying to find a place to pull a few points from to add 2 more multi meltas.

I like your ideas tho since you immediatley found the original issue I had with DS armies. Thats why Tigurius became key to fixing that.

Go ahead and re-check the list now that were straight on the turn 2 thing, you have good insights.

ThePov
08-25-2009, 07:05 PM
That just makes it worse. Tac suqads are good units, they're scoring, but they are also EXPENSIVE. You do NOT want to be wasting one on a turn one drop alone. You're basically giving the enemy a 1KP and 205 point advantage, plus your only scoring units are now two smal Scout Squads, which will not hold onto an objective nearly as well as a late-dropping Tac squad. Honestly, the problem with your conecpt is that there really is no unit in the SM codex that is expendable enough to throw away like that on a suicide drop, not to mention that a re-roll doesn't garuntee that stuff will come in. You're essentially tying a hand behind your back and praying that your reserves don't all screw up and come in at random times with this list, and I'm not sure I'd be comofrtable with that. If you think it can work, playtest it and let me know. I'd be interested to find out how it went, either way.

EDIT:If you REALLY want to go with the second turn drop strategy, ditch the drop pods, sterngaurd, and Tac squad all together. Spend the Sterngaurd points on a shooty Termie unit and mount the scouts in Land Speeder Storms. I'm not sure how effective it will be, but it would certainly be a unique army, and one I'd like to face, just for the interesting tactical challenge.

Spanklet
08-25-2009, 08:15 PM
Thanks for the followup!!

Item E under 'extra info' addressed the TAC squad staying out of sight turn 1.

And its true, re-rolling the reserves is a crap shoot and the odds can turn on me but without Tigurius im almost guaranteed a piecemeal drop :(. Odds are ill still get about 80% of my force down simultaneously on turn 2 taking into account rolls that fail twice.

I think the no-pod version you mentioned is worth exploring as well, sounds good.

EDIT: Crap...I started putting together the no-pod version to see what it looks like and remembered why I didnt before...Tigurius does not have a JP, DP or termie armor option so he has to drop pod in attached to a squad or walk in from reserve. Actually thats not a bad idea since he can teleport 24".

ThePov
08-25-2009, 09:56 PM
Chances are, if you drop the Tac Squad in a place where they're safe, it's also a place they aren't going to be helpful. On foot, they're not gonna get where they need to go nearly fast enough, and they're still vulnerable while they're trying to get into the action.

As for Tigurius, just have him walk in, and call it teleporting in. Better than the suicide drop idea.

Spanklet
08-25-2009, 11:10 PM
I think your suggestion is the way to regarding the no pod vesrion.

I am going to submit a guidelines based list request and see what comes in.