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Cyndr
12-06-2010, 02:26 PM
I'm going to break the mold a bit from what I normally play in my Nid list here, and I'm really looking forward to some feedback on what I've thought up on paper. I normally do a rather shooty nid list with a bunch of devil-gants, warriors, dakka-tyrant, etc. This time I want to see about something a bit faster to bring the fight to the opposite side of the table.

Here's what I'm thinking:

HQ:
Hive Tyrant:
Bonesword/Lashwhip, Scything Talons, Hive Commander, Old Adversary, Wings, Leach Essence, Paroxism

Hive Tyrant:
Bonesword/Lashwhip, Scything Talons, Old Adversary, Wings, Leach Essence, Paroxism


Elite:
Venomthrope

Venomthrope

2x Zoanthrope

Troop:
10x Genestealers
Toxin Sacs

10x Genestealers
Toxin Sacs

17x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


17x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


18x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


18x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs

Heavy Support:
Trygon
Adrenal Glands

Pts: 1998
M-Count: 97


The idea here is that I want to get across the board as quickly as possible. One of my tyrants has hive commander so that I can A: increase the rate that my reserves arrive, and B: let me outflank one of my hormagaunt broods (probably one of my 18 count ones). The Venomthropes are separate on purpose, as this will increase the area that I can cover with the additional cover saves and increase the number of units I can get some lashwhips into as long as they aren't shot down (which I expect will not happen quickly, as the hormagaunts are going to be charging down the table towards the hopefully panicking enemy.)

In the beginning the venoms with provide cover saves for the little bugs, and then shift their protection priorities over to the trygon, zoans and the flyrants, who will all be seeking out something large and metal to vaporize or rip open. While the enemy will be dealing with the large number of hormagaunts jumping down it's throat, the stealers will come in from the sides looking for something juicy sitting foolishly at the edge of the lines, and the other hormagaunts will be searching for the same.

So lets hear what you think. Looking forward to hearing back. :D

Tynskel
12-06-2010, 07:21 PM
i like the concept. I feel, though, that you could either use hive guard, or a basic carnifex can opener. Something to just bust open transports. The Hive Tyrants can do this, but they are better at doing just about anything else.

Cyndr
12-09-2010, 12:51 AM
I should be able to drop each of the squads of hormagaunts down to 15 each. That leaves me with enough points to add a brood of two hive guard to the mix. The only thing that worries me about that is that I can not move and shoot with them. Should I just try to get tjem to a centralized location so I can maximize their coverage on the table?

Fizyx
12-09-2010, 06:08 AM
I should be able to drop each of the squads of hormagaunts down to 15 each. That leaves me with enough points to add a brood of two hive guard to the mix. The only thing that worries me about that is that I can not move and shoot with them. Should I just try to get tjem to a centralized location so I can maximize their coverage on the table?

Wait, since when can you not move and shoot with Hive Guard? Impaler Cannon is Assault 2, not heavy.

Unless you are talking about a complete lack of Synapse, which you currently have. I would definitely make sure the Hive Guard are at least withing Synapse for turn 2. Maybe tie them to the Zoanthropes.

It is an interesting list. It'll be devastating if you can be sure to open enough transports to have something to assault.

Cyndr
12-09-2010, 09:03 AM
Whoops... That's what I get for posting from work without my codex handy. That makes me feel a lot better about bringing the hive guard. Lets go ahead and amend this list then:

HQ:
Hive Tyrant:
Bonesword/Lashwhip, Scything Talons, Hive Commander, Old Adversary, Wings, Leach Essence, Paroxism

Hive Tyrant:
Bonesword/Lashwhip, Scything Talons, Old Adversary, Wings, Leach Essence, Paroxism


Elite:
2x Venomthrope

2x Hive Guard

2x Zoanthrope

Troop:
10x Genestealers
Toxin Sacs

10x Genestealers
Toxin Sacs

15x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


15x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


15x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs


15x Hormagaunts
Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs

Heavy Support:
Trygon
Adrenal Glands

Pts: 1998
M-Count: 89

blackarmchair
12-09-2010, 10:44 AM
As said before, I like the idea of this list but I don't think it gets accomplished very well.

First and foremost, you will fail utterly at de-meching people with 2x Hiveguard & 2x Zoanthropes. You're going to need a better way to open transports. I recommend at least 2 squads of 3 Hive Guard.

Second, those Hive Tyrants are actually very fragile. I like that you put them with wings, just know that they will get ahead of the rest of your army and your opponent will shoot them with everything he has. I prefer Armoured Shell tyrants with Tyrant Guard. They're much harder to take down. PLUS since the Tyrant is now "part of a unit" (he counts as an IC) he can now benefit from a cover save if you use gaunts to obscure LoS to the Tyrant Guard. A 2+/4++ makes them VERY resilient.

Also, you may think 60x Hormagants are a lot. It's not. Take it from someone who routinely fields 100+ Boyz they don't last as long as you want them too. There are better ways to get a gaunt shield - namely: Tervigons. In this style list take at least 2, I recommend 3 but at least 2.

These guys do everything ever needed to win 40k ever. They spawn troops, they give out FnP, they're synapse, they confer furious charge and poison attacks to all the termagants around them, they're monstrous creatures, they're troops, they can allow your Hive Guard to move, run and still shoot AND they make cookies...delicious cookies.

Ok, so they don't make cookies, but the rest is totally true. Troops selection should be 3x squads of 10 termagants and 3x Tervigons.

Finally, Trygons are awesome. But 1 trygon will die a terrible terrible death. When fielding Trygons 2 is the minimum, 3 is preferred.

Cool idea though, this is the style of play I see Tyranids being best at in this ed. They've become a highly synergistic army and it's important to remember that each unit needs to support and be supported by another.

Good luck with the list. Post some battle reports to let us know how it's going?

Cyndr
12-09-2010, 11:30 AM
@blackarmchair:

While I can appreciate your opinions and preferences to the units that you have suggested, and the amounts of which you prefer to deploy them (given specific minimums you would personally field), lets try to keep the comments (positive or otherwise) to the list I have written out. You have basically suggested that I completely re-write the list from the ground up by literally changing EVERY FOC slot in the list. This is not particularly productive or helpful to me.

As for de-meching an enemy, what I lack is more ranged anti-armor. Don't discount the 3 quick moving MCs I still have roving around the table.

Hopefully I will be able to give a battle report after this weekend. I will keep you posted.

ursvamp
12-09-2010, 12:06 PM
Hi!
I like the list and way of thinking alot :D

However, perhaps you'd like to consider adrenal glands instead of poison attacks on your Genestealers. (I personally find this to be more useful in most circumstances).
I had one game with stealers w. Furious Charge, and one with them havin poisin instead. and I found the difference in lethiality to be quite big actually!

However, I alsways run a broodlord in the stealer units :) a broodlord in a stealerbrood with FC is a unit that can basically kill anything including vehicles and dreadnoughts :)

Any certain reason/though in mind that made you pick poison?

Cyndr
12-09-2010, 05:27 PM
My general thought behind using toxin sacs instead of adrenal glands was that against every unit that I have equal to or greater than the toughness of the enemy model I will be able to re-roll to wound, which will enhance the rending claws that come standard on the stealers. So, if I have one of my hive tyrants near by, I will be re-rolling to hit (preferred enemy) and re-rolling to wound (toxin sacs) on most enemy models, unless I am attacking something with T5 or more. Since an enemy model with that kind of toughness is better handled by a different unit (like say, a hive tyrant or trygon) I figured in most cases I would be able to get the re-roll, and therefore, extra chances to rend.

The extra strength on the charge, and bonus initiative just don't seem to give the same advantage. I will typically be attacking first with the I6, and the extra strength is good, but like you said, probably better used on a broodlord as an extra means of taking out light armor. The light armor will be left to other units in my list, unless I get desperate to pop a transport or something, in which case I should be able to get enough attacks in to glance it a few times anyway. As for the dreadnoughts... well... I should have my Hive Tyrants on them like glue. A stealer brood with no broodlord that gets jumped by a dreadnought is a dead brood.

Sorry if I was rambling in this one, haha... just woke up, but I think you get the idea. :D

Tynskel
12-09-2010, 06:07 PM
I like this list. Fun n' fast.

I like to tweak lists...
I like the three fast monstrous creatures. Those are fun.
have u thought about flying rippers? A small throw away squad or two can be fun-- act like a bodyguard to your three big bugs. 69 points for 3 bases. That's toxin and adrenal glands. Because they cannot screen monstrous creatures, you just hide them behind your big bugs. 3+ cover saves. But, on the charge, they pump out 15 rerolling to hit and wound attacks (tyrant + toxin at str4). Not bad, for a throw away unit. You can get two for one hormoguant squad. Not Bad, especially since they can directly keep up with your tyrants.

Cyndr
12-09-2010, 06:22 PM
That's an interesting thought. Chances are very low that they would draw any kind of fire. I'm sure most opponents underestimate ripper bases, since they were mostly just tar pits in the last codex. One hormagaunt brood to about 6 ripper bases, with a few more points to play with to add toys to the trygon, or maybe something else. I'll have to try that out in one of my games.

Honestly never really seriously considered rippers before, but looking at the codex entry, that is a lot of attacks that an over looked unit can put out that will keep up with the Flyrants. Just have to look out for blasts I suppose.

That's exactly what this list is for too. Just want to run a fun list that is different that what I'm used to. Expand my tactics a bit, and get out of my comfort zone that I established with my eldar lists. I found that my bug lists started to mimic my eldar tactics simply because it was something I was comfortable with. This one doesn't allow the use of the same tactics, so will defiantly be a change of pace.