PDA

View Full Version : Eldar - again!



mercer
09-04-2009, 08:28 AM
I've pimped this list on a few blogs I visit asking for advice, I've managed to strain out the crap and got this now. ONly question is I have 160 points left, what shall I do with it? I could add Eldrad?

Also, where should I put Eldrad/Farseer?

HQ

1 x Autarch - mandiblasters, power weapon & fusion gun - 100

Farseer - Doom, Fortune & runes of witnessing - 140


Elites

10 x Striking Scorpions w/ Wave Serpent - serpent w/ brightlance - 295
6 x Fire Dragons w/ Falcon - 211
6 x Fire Dragons w/ Falcon - 211

Troops

10 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - serpent w/ brightlance - 255
10 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - serpent w/ brightlance - 255
10 x Dire Avengers w/ Wave Serpent - serpent w/ brightlance - 255

Heavy Support

Fire Prism - 115

total 1837

Any ideas fine folk of BOLS Lounge?

karandras
09-04-2009, 12:12 PM
I like the list. It will really thrash mech armies. You are a little light on anti-personnel weaponry. I would consider upgrading the farseer to eldrad and sticking him and your autarch with the striking scorpions. I would spend the remaining points on a jetbike squad of 6 with 2 shuriken cannons. Good luck!

mercer
09-04-2009, 02:14 PM
I like the list. It will really thrash mech armies. You are a little light on anti-personnel weaponry. I would consider upgrading the farseer to eldrad and sticking him and your autarch with the striking scorpions. I would spend the remaining points on a jetbike squad of 6 with 2 shuriken cannons. Good luck!

I cannot remember point values, but I know upgrading to Eldrad will use a good portion of the points. I'm now sure on the jetbike price either, I take it you mean shining spears though? I'll check it out.

karandras
09-04-2009, 02:43 PM
A unit of 6 Guardian Jetbikes with 2 Shuriken Cannons is 152 points. A unit of 5 with 1 Shuriken Cannon is 120. Jetbikes are troops and extremely useful for grabbing objectives. I don't particularly like Shining Spears. You said you had about 160 points to burn.

Goresmack
09-04-2009, 03:03 PM
A unit of 6 Guardian Jetbikes with 2 Shuriken Cannons is 152 points. A unit of 5 with 1 Shuriken Cannon is 120. Jetbikes are troops and extremely useful for grabbing objectives. I don't particularly like Shining Spears. You said you had about 160 points to burn.

Karandras speaks the truth, Guardian Jetbikes can play a great role in any Eldar army, by both doing what Karandras said and killing troops with lots of shurikens and they also make a great last minute objective grabber/contester. Plus you wont lose that sense of speed you have with the list currently.

-Goresmack

Tsear
09-04-2009, 03:13 PM
I don't know that you really need an autarch in this list. Scorpions are already pretty powerful, and while they certainly won't win all their fights, I don't think having an autarch will help them in the fights that they would lose anyway, as he only adds something like 5 S3 power weapon attacks.

With two squads of fire dragons, I don't know that you need all that many brightlances on your transports. If you drop them to shuriken cannons, you'll have more anti-horde firepower and will still be able to use your transports to deal with armor. TL Shuriken cannons are better at killing AV10 than a TL Lance.

Speaking of the fire dragons, the unit as is is illegal, as the falcon needs to buy a weapon. I think a serpent is a better transport for dragons anyway.

Your dire avengers could really use an exarch with bladestorm, this helps their damage output incredibly. Bladestorm's drawback doesn't really come into play in a mech list, as you'll drop, bladestorm, and probably load up into your transport to leave again the next turn.

Finally, I think it would be a good idea to invest in spirit stones. Your army needs to get to the front together, and having your strategy messed up because of a stunned result or two is something you probably want to avoid.

Edit: If you still have spare points, I would suggest possibly switching your seer for Eldrad, adding more prisms, or maybe getting some more troop choices. With three avenger squads in transports you're probably okay for troops (I only run two and they usually aren't wiped out), but it wouldn't hurt to pick up a GJB squad or just guardian defenders. Either way, against most armies it would be a good idea to hold GJB and defenders in reserve, as they will be the only squad outside of a transport and so will draw the fire of every Anti-Infantry heavy weapon your opponent has.

Timbo
09-04-2009, 04:15 PM
Runes of warding are much better than runes of witnessing in a competitive list. Although if you're upgrading to Eldrad he gets these anyway. Shutting down your opponent's nasty psychic stuff anywhere on the table is huge, especially with all of those ld9 IG psykers out there.

davel
09-05-2009, 04:08 AM
looking at your list these things I would be considering.
though as ever the curse of the eldar ...never enough points

falcons spirit stones definatly and on as many vital transports
falcons maybe holofield (expensive and it looks like ant tank is covered so this force may get away with out it)
runes of warding ( lash armies have taught me this)
upgrade autarch to yariel

dave l

mercer
09-05-2009, 06:03 AM
A unit of 6 Guardian Jetbikes with 2 Shuriken Cannons is 152 points. A unit of 5 with 1 Shuriken Cannon is 120. Jetbikes are troops and extremely useful for grabbing objectives. I don't particularly like Shining Spears. You said you had about 160 points to burn.

Oh, some confusing words. I thought you meant upgrade Eldrad AND the bikes. I've looked at the guardian jetbikes and they seem ok. I don't know about Eldrad as I won't use all the psychic powers any way.


I don't know that you really need an autarch in this list. Scorpions are already pretty powerful, and while they certainly won't win all their fights, I don't think having an autarch will help them in the fights that they would lose anyway, as he only adds something like 5 S3 power weapon attacks.

With two squads of fire dragons, I don't know that you need all that many brightlances on your transports. If you drop them to shuriken cannons, you'll have more anti-horde firepower and will still be able to use your transports to deal with armor. TL Shuriken cannons are better at killing AV10 than a TL Lance.

Speaking of the fire dragons, the unit as is is illegal, as the falcon needs to buy a weapon. I think a serpent is a better transport for dragons anyway.

Your dire avengers could really use an exarch with bladestorm, this helps their damage output incredibly. Bladestorm's drawback doesn't really come into play in a mech list, as you'll drop, bladestorm, and probably load up into your transport to leave again the next turn.

Finally, I think it would be a good idea to invest in spirit stones. Your army needs to get to the front together, and having your strategy messed up because of a stunned result or two is something you probably want to avoid.

Edit: If you still have spare points, I would suggest possibly switching your seer for Eldrad, adding more prisms, or maybe getting some more troop choices. With three avenger squads in transports you're probably okay for troops (I only run two and they usually aren't wiped out), but it wouldn't hurt to pick up a GJB squad or just guardian defenders. Either way, against most armies it would be a good idea to hold GJB and defenders in reserve, as they will be the only squad outside of a transport and so will draw the fire of every Anti-Infantry heavy weapon your opponent has.

The Autarch compliments the scorpions very well, 5 S3 power weapon attacks aren't to be sneered at and add a fusion gun for a one shot damage before trooping in.

Erm brightlances are long rang anti vehicle, fire dragons have a 12" range and need to be in 6" to roll 2D6. The dragons will be a high prority target, and are notihng more than a sacrifice unit and will die. Brightlances are very much needed. The Falcon also is a anti tank unit, it goes well with another anti tank unit - though I will add another weapon on them, I must have missed it ;)

I won't be taking bladestorm, I don't want something which doesn't allow me to shoot for a turn and with the fire power they are dish out it will attract my opponents attention and they won't even make it back into the transport next turn.

Adding those jetbike guardians would work, but I'd keep them off the board in which the Autarch would come in useful for this.


Runes of warding are much better than runes of witnessing in a competitive list. Although if you're upgrading to Eldrad he gets these anyway. Shutting down your opponent's nasty psychic stuff anywhere on the table is huge, especially with all of those ld9 IG psykers out there.

I don't play many which have psykers nor IG players either. I don't think adding wargear particularly for a particular unit in a particular army is a good idea, especially when I don't play that army much.


looking at your list these things I would be considering.
though as ever the curse of the eldar ...never enough points

falcons spirit stones definatly and on as many vital transports
falcons maybe holofield (expensive and it looks like ant tank is covered so this force may get away with out it)
runes of warding ( lash armies have taught me this)
upgrade autarch to yariel

dave l

I'll probably add spirit stones to the falcons only, a no brainer would be to take these unit and make the fire dragons foot slog it.

I'm not worried about lash, its not massively used so much.

What benefits does that autarch character provide?

Ghoulio
09-06-2009, 02:02 PM
I have been working on a list very similar to what you have there, except I took the following (keep in mind this is from memory and is "more or less" what I have):

HQ
1) Yuriel -
2) Autarch - w/ power weapon, fusion blaster (basically what you have)

Elites
1) Between 7-10 fire dragons in a wave serpent w/brightlances/spirit stones

Troops
3 x 10 Dire avengers with Exarch that has two catapults and bladestorm - wave serpents (same as fire dragon one)

Heavy Support
2x Fire Prisims w/ holo fields
3 Warwalkers w/ either 6 scatter lasers or 6 missile launchers. With the missile launchers you get 6 templates or 6 krak missiles at long range. I would probably do the scatter lasers myself since they scout you can keep at arms length and 24 str 6 shots is gross.

The reason for the two Autarchs instead of a farseer is because this entire army starts in reserve and everyone comes in on turn two on a 2+. I think bladestorm is much better then you give it credit for. The idea would be to come out and lay down 96 shots in one turn, hopefully nuking the main threat of your opponent, then getting back in next turn and picking their next target.

As far as adding 160 pts to your list I think putting Yriel in there for an extra 55 points would be awesome (power weapon that wounds on a 2+ and if he gets swarmed by a horde army he can kill many many things in one shot:) ), and just kitting out the rest of your tanks with spirit stones, maybe a holo field for the Prisim. GO ELDAR!!!

mercer
09-07-2009, 07:15 AM
I really don't see the point in taking Yriel at all. For 155 you get 1 more attack and inititive over a normal autrach a singing spear and a S6 large blast. Also taking a model which could die because of its only silly rules is never a bonus. I thnik Yriel is a over costed special character only adds to the army which a generic autrach can do without taking armour saves because of silly rules.

I've been on both ends of bladestorm and I didn't find it entertaining at all. On the receiving end my marines passed all the armour saves, which I must admit is some good luck dice rolling. Giving a bladestorm only attracts attention, you opponent knows how much power they can dish out and will gun them down. If its the eldar turn and you bladestorm, then the next turn you will get gunned down and chances are few dire avengers will make it back into the transport to repeat the trick. Its a one trick pony in my opinion and costs many points for the power and then the exarch as well. If your transport has been popped your in even more trouble and no doubt you will get gunned down, chances are bladestorm will be used once per game per unit.

Having two autarchs is no benefit, you will still come on the board on a 2+ anyway on the second turn.

I think holofield on the fire prism would be a benefit, considering thats the only way. I think I'm going to get some guardian jetbikes, and then the rest on a few bits and pieces of wargear.

Ghoulio
09-07-2009, 08:38 AM
There are two main reasons why I think Yriel is amazing. First off his singing spear ignores armor saves...so he pretty much always hits on a 3+ and wounds on a 2+, where as a normal Autarch wounds a marine/ork on a 5+. So even if the guy gets 5 attacks he will hit with 3-4 times and wound maybe once or twice. The second is that template is incredible. If you charge a unit then they HAVE to surround you. So if its a marine unit you are hitting 10 models and killing them on a 2+ (so on average 8-9 should die). Even if he dies at the end of combat due to a power fist or something chances are he has earned his points value in one go (this is even better if its a horde army with a large unit). Also, another thing that is nice is that against vehicles the singing spear is better then a melta gun over 6" as its str 9, but the main down side is if you are shooting at troops it isnt really all that good. He is also only 55 pts more then a regular Autarch and you still get a save vs. the wound he takes at the end of the game.

As for the two Autarch the thing is each one gives you +1 on your reserve roll, so the second turn of the game if you only have one your stuff comes in on a 3+, not a 2+. I guess it really just boils down to your play style and what you would rather on the board as Farseers do really improve your army. All in all though regardless of what you do I think it will be super fun army to play :)

mercer
09-07-2009, 09:01 AM
I dont think those benefits are worth 55 points and rolling for a uncalled for armour save after each turn - I could kill my own man!

The benefits of a Farseer outweigh having a second autarch, they provide something to a unit/army in, unlike Yriel who is just a fancy special character with a singing spear in a power weapon form. I just don't see Yriel as a benefit for what he brings to the table, I would rather have a army benefit than fancy wargear.