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View Full Version : 1500 pts Emp Children help please guys for crimbo (:



druchi
12-03-2009, 10:49 AM
Hey guys I posted this on the IG message Board but with crimbo coming up I was hoping for some constructive criticism this is just a rough idea so guys help please :cool:

oh by the my, first post been haunting BoLS for a while now but finally decided to join great site guys.

HQ:

Chaos Lord MoS, combi bolter,Blissgiver, melta nades = 160 pts

Sorcerer with Mos, Lash of Submission, melta nades = 125 pts

Elites:

Chosen x 5 with power 4 power weapons and one plasma gun, MoS + Rhino = 195 pt

Troops:

6 Noise marines with sonic blaster, Noise champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

6 noise marines with sonic blasters, Noise Champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

10 Chaos Marines with rhino = 185 pts

10 Chaos Marines with rhino = 185 pts

Fast Attack

6 x Raptors with two Meltaguns = 120 pts

6 x Raptors with Two Meltaguns = 120 pts

total = 1520 pts

Thoughts? :D

Cryl
12-04-2009, 03:44 AM
The problem with that chosen unit is that it's expensive (it's 220 point by my count for 4 power weapons, plasma gun, Icon of Slaanesh and a rhino), will die pretty easily and there's no ablative wound models in there. I would probably drop them, give my lord or sorceror termie armour and pair them with some slaaneshi termies instead.

I'm not convinced that you need 280 points of HQ in a 1500 point list either, I'd go for one or the other

Your CSM squads having no special weapons just isn't right give them a couple of meltas or plasmas each and let them do more than camp objectives. If your serious about your Slaaneshi them then give them icons and throw in a power weapon as well but that's all about the theme imo.

Raptors aren't considered particularly great in the CSM book but in your list they're quite themic so hang on to them although I'm not sure that 2 squads are needed or that you'll have the points once you tweak up the other areas of the list.

Let us know what you do with this

Scoota
12-04-2009, 04:14 AM
I agree with a lot of what Cryl said.
Taking a look at your list, you've doubled up on a lot of the units so there's not a lot of diversity in there.

I used to play Slaanesh under the old rules, where you could take Daemonettes to support your Noise Marines, and they were an absolutely potent force.
Even in the current dex, a unit or two of Lesser Daemons that can be summoned through the icons will give your shooty units a good CC "surprise" against any opponent that gets too close. Of course, you can't rely on when they're going to come down, but they can charge on the turn that they come down (I think) and they're S4T4 too. Even the Greater Daemons are stellar at 100 points, although they require you to sacrifice an Aspiring Champion.

Noise Marines are an interesting army - you can take lots of shooting, and your boys (or girls) are all I5, so they work well as a defensive army that can take a charge and still attack first against most enemies.
Even an Obliterator or two, or a cheap-as-chips Predator or Vindicator, can add a bit of firepower and allow your troops choices to be a bit more CC orientated.

Hope these comments help.

druchi
12-04-2009, 05:18 AM
Hey guys thanks for the feedback.

I had been considering dropping the Chosen as I only truly chose them as a retinue for one of my HQ choices in which case you could say I spent 300 pts on one HQ.

The original plan was to have the noise marines and raptors be the main 'assault' force but with Noise marines being able to do either assault or blast things amazingly well I see them as a multi-purpose unit that can fit the bill as required.

just another point terminators with MoS I can only see being useful with double lightning claws would this be considered a good investment?

The Raptors where chosen to give some anti tank punch to this list there is not a great deal of mech at my local club and when tanks are chosen they tend to end up shaken or stunned for most of the game.

To the point about the CSM squads with no special weapons, these poor sods are to be holding objectives or as support for the Noise Marines (they all come with CC weps and Bolt Pistols) they where also a cheap way to get some 'meat' into the list hold objectives and they are still hard as nails Space Marines. Although I do think in retrospect a special weapon could be useful.

last point about dropping one HQ which would you recommend? Blissgiver seems almost to good to be true whilst many people go on about the dreaded 'Lash' so any clues mate?

Hey there Scoota sadly I had already decided against using summoned daemons as I wanted just pure marine going about also just adding this is based very loosely on a Heresy Era army.

lets try a little rework :P

HQ:

Chaos Lord MoS, combi bolter,Blissgiver, melta nades = 160 pts

Elites:

5 Terminators with, Lightning Claws, MoS = 215 pts (youch!)

Troops:

6 Noise marines with sonic blaster, Noise champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

6 noise marines with sonic blasters, Noise Champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

so at 805 pts so far and with a termi squad costing the same as my Noise Marines hmmm...

10 CSM with rhino, MoS, Champion, power weapon = 225 pts (lend some CC punch to noise marines)

10 CSM with rhino, MoS, Champion, power weapon = 225 pts

Heavy support:

Vindicator = 125

Vindicator = 125

Total = 1535 ( at our local club your allowed to go 95 pts over the limit at most)

What you guys think? sadly had to drop the raptors and I don't see the point in taking just one Vindicator although swapping other than those two the list seems very lacking in the Anti Tank department. Perhaps a land raider?

mercer
12-04-2009, 05:33 AM
Ok looking at the new list:

A daemon prince is better than a chaos lord any day of the week, though blissgiver is nice. I don't think melta bombs are that good. You only get one shot at vehicles and against a walker you need a 6 to plant the bomb. For 5 points they don't cost a lot, but they might not do a lot either.

Chaos Terminators are ok, though I guess these would go with the Chaos Lord. If so I would give one a power fist to smack vehicles, walkers, tough infantry and monstrous creatures.

A power fist on at least one champion wouldn't go a-miss for reasons I mentioned above ;)

This list is good for anti infantry, but no anti tank. Pop the vindicators and this list can't do a fat lot, or nothing at all against armour.

Must say though, allowing to go 95 points over the limit is daft. What is the point in having a limit? And 1,500 games will become 1,600, may as well make armies 1,600 points instead of 1,500.

druchi
12-04-2009, 05:50 AM
because you get penalised for going over the limit (current tournament) so I try to stick pretty much to the 1500 :P

I dont want to use a daemon prince at all sadly.

sticking a powerfist on a unit with MoS wastes the I5 attacks that I would get from that unit same with champions in sqauds.

and as I said tanks arent normally a huge factor at our club most armies are either massed infantry like guard with maybe a hellhound or couple of LR which arent that hard to ignore in cover, the other main type of army I see at my club is the drop pod kind.

what would you suggest instead of the vindicators then? Defilers? Land Raider? also what would you suggest other than powerfists to take out enemy armour for the reasons I just stated?

Scoota
12-04-2009, 06:19 AM
Just had a quick look through the C:CSM codex, and thought of a few different unit builds you could chuck in.

Instead of the CSM units adding CC punch, for 165 points you could take a unit of 6 Noise Marines with an Aspiring Champion, P. Weapon and Doom Siren (S5AP3). This will give you more CC punch than your unit of 10 Marines... as long as they survive to get there.

Given that the Noise Marines are Fearless, you could drop the Champion and P. Weapon in your units with the Sonic Blasters to make them more dedicated shooters, but since they're still at I5, they will attack before most enemies, and use another unit to support them in CC.

With the CSMs, taking out the P. Weapon frees up points for a melta gun, which gives you some of the punch that the Raptors had, if you wanted them to be more fire support. Given the Initiative advantage the Noise Marines have, I'd be tempted to make them the CC units, and the CSMs the fire support.

And as you noticed, the Terminators only cost 20 points more than your Chosen, and will probably last a bit longer. You also now have the opportunity to Deep Strike them. It might be worth putting Icons in your units so that the Termies won't scatter.

You're right, the 2 Vindicators will function good as a pair, and will be able to take out large numbers of troops to soften up your enemies for your units.

I can understand not wanting to take the Daemons - making a fluffy army can be fun. I think you've got a good list, it's just a matter of getting the CC and the shooty units doing the right things.

Just my 2 cents - if only we still had the last codex to play with, Noise Marines truly ruled then.

Scoota
12-04-2009, 06:24 AM
sticking a powerfist on a unit with MoS wastes the I5 attacks that I would get from that unit same with champions in sqauds.

If you are going to use a power fist for smacking things down, I'd say take a chain fist, as this will give you that extra oomph against vehicles. Or one model with a combi-melta and power weapon.


and as I said tanks arent normally a huge factor at our club most armies are either massed infantry like guard with maybe a hellhound or couple of LR which arent that hard to ignore in cover, the other main type of army I see at my club is the drop pod kind.

The Demolisher cannon on your Vindicators are S10, so can do a fair whack of damage to vehicles as well as infantry, and if you take a melta-gun or two in your CSM squads, or a Lascannon if you're going to use them as a fire base, you can have a few more anti-vehicle options.

druchi
12-04-2009, 06:39 AM
Hey thanks for the swift reply(s). I think I will more or less stick with the second list and maybe drop the power weapons in my line CSM squads for some melta, I decided to take a combi-gun on the chaos lord and with meltabombs being so cheap I thought it would be ok dokay or perhaps getting some daemonic possession (skilled drivers :P) for the vindicators so they don't end up stunned most of the game.

I was throwing up the idea of whether to have Doom Siren and power sword but then I realised how many points I was paying for one champion and it came to decision between the two I choose the power weapon.

since the whole army is pretty mobile I think It would be safe to stick the lord with terminators and then think about taking that personal icon tah for some food for thought! :cool:

now... just need to work my *** off from now till crimbo and hope to buy most of it then thanks a million guys.

Jwolf
12-04-2009, 08:49 AM
Noise marine champions exist to have Doom Sirens. If you're going to have Noise Marines, please take Doom Sirens - think of the (emperor's) children!

druchi
12-04-2009, 08:53 AM
But the cost dear lord!

20 pts guy + 15 for champ + 15 for Doom Siren + 15 for Power weapon :P

hes expensive! :eek:

mercer
12-04-2009, 10:59 AM
because you get penalised for going over the limit (current tournament) so I try to stick pretty much to the 1500 :P

I dont want to use a daemon prince at all sadly.

sticking a powerfist on a unit with MoS wastes the I5 attacks that I would get from that unit same with champions in sqauds.

and as I said tanks arent normally a huge factor at our club most armies are either massed infantry like guard with maybe a hellhound or couple of LR which arent that hard to ignore in cover, the other main type of army I see at my club is the drop pod kind.

what would you suggest instead of the vindicators then? Defilers? Land Raider? also what would you suggest other than powerfists to take out enemy armour for the reasons I just stated?

Why don't you want to use a Daemon Prince for? Chaos Lords suck balls simple as. For 20 points extra yuo get a better profile model which allows no armour saves.

A power fist does indeed mean striking last, but if you take a power weapon what are you going to do when that Dreadnought or Carnifex charges? You will die thats what will happen as you cannot scratch it. Always worth taking one power fist. Saved my bacon many times. Power fists aren't just for tanks, if you read what I said originaly ;)

I didn't actually say replace the Vindicators - I like Vindicators :cool: . Though now that you mention it Defilers would be better. Reason is long shot, but thats not massively important. What is, is stronger side armour and the Defiler can fight back. If you said mass infantry are the old 4th edition lists your club plays with them see how they get on with two Defilers charging at them. Add a extra close combat weapon though and keep the heavy flamer to burn some before you roll in.

druchi
12-13-2009, 12:25 PM
That was my idea exactly with the defiler not only that but fleet so they can keep up with the rhinos which I can use to screen them.

I don't want to use a daemon prince as this is a loosely based heresy army I can stick a an Adeptus mechanicus guy out the top from my loyalist predator spare parts so I can use the defiler as robot thingys :P

as a side note anyone know anywhere I can get 5 pairs of lightning claws...?

Time to bring on the crimbo and the skulls of my enemies!
Thanks for your help everyone!
so here it is the revised list

HQ:

Chaos Lord MoS,Blissgiver, = 135 pts

Elites:

5 Terminators with, Lightning Claws, MoS = 215 pts

Troops:

6 Noise marines with sonic blaster, Noise champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

6 noise marines with sonic blaster, Noise Champion, Power weapon rhino = 215 pts

10 CSM with rhino, meltagun, meltagun = 205 pts

10 CSM with rhino, Mos, Champion, Power Weapon = 235 pts

Heavy Support:

Defiler with extra CCW = 150 pts

Defiler with extra CCW = 150 pts

Total = 1520

Awesome =D

mercer
12-14-2009, 07:26 AM
Fleet only allows you to assault after running, though, defilers are walkers and can run though ;)

druchi
12-14-2009, 08:46 AM
Pure evil. > : )

druchi
12-18-2009, 07:47 AM
ok two lists here one I felt uncomfortable with the last list and decided I will just get whatever I decide on for my birthday


HQ:

Lord with Blissgiver, combi bolter, MoS = 145 pts

Elites:

5 Terminators with, Lightning Claws, MoS = 215 pts

Troops:

6 Noise Marines with Noise champion, Power sword, Doom Siren, rhino = 200 pts

10 CSM with MoS, Champion, Power Weapon, 2 melta, rhino =255 pts

10 CSM with MoS, Champion, Power Weapon, 2 melta, rhino =255 pts

Fast Attack:

6 Raptors with Champion, Power Sword, MoS, 2 flamers = 175 pts

Heavy Support:

Defiler with extra CCW = 150 pts

Dakka Predator with HB, Havoc Launcher = 115 pts

Total = 1495 pts

Far more character in this list I think Lord rides with the Doom siren and with 5 meltaguns spread out across this army I think I will be ok ;)

The two other CSM squads will be forming the main 'sucker punch' of the force with the Terminators able to deep strike down slice and dice their way through whatever I deem worthy of needing killed outright.

Rhino's keep the army fast and manoeuvrable the Raptors are therefore a perfect support unit with a power weapon to get stuck in and 2 flamers to be a threat to units camping objectives and anything in cover.

Dakka Predator is an obvious choice against the typical massed infantry flatten your face tactics at my FLGC.

Defiler for the BC and assault killing which fits the bill of diversity and a heavy flamer to cause alot of damage to non MEQ's

I think this is a much better list but I want to hear your thoughts (:

Mr. Smith
12-18-2009, 12:17 PM
Why don't you want to use a Daemon Prince for? Chaos Lords suck balls simple as. For 20 points extra yuo get a better profile model which allows no armour saves.



Yeah, but with the army list he's making, he won't have a very surviveable Daemon Prince. The opponent will assume that the prince knows Lash of Submission and shoot Lascannons at it. Killing it the first turn it comes in. a Slaanesh Lord, however, will most likely will be ignored because of what you just said. Until he mistakenly assaults it and has about four instant death, no armor saves to deal with.

druchi
12-21-2009, 06:16 AM
Also the Daemon Prince model doesn't look nearly as cool as the Lord I have converted :p
And again I have to come back to the point this is a loosely based heresy era army.

Defiler will need a Dark Mechanicus marine sticking out the top hatch :cool:

I may get rid of hte havoc launcher and for 5 pts more buy Demonic Possession which would allow me to negate all those annoying stunned and whatever results although with all the spare Havoc launcher bits Im going to have I could build some sort of Calliope type tank.

Wish I had some sort of camera upload to show you guys but sadly I dont ): In other news my maxi mini steam knight helmets arrived and Im going to be getting to work on those after the crimbo break (: will also now need beer keg jump packs...

also I've just recently been asked by a friend who is new to the hobby to make him an army list based on what he knows he has got (and he's getting some for crimbo these are both friendly lists) so would really appreciate the comments there too anyway thanks a Bazillion guys

Jwolf
12-21-2009, 08:54 AM
But the cost dear lord!

20 pts guy + 15 for champ + 15 for Doom Siren + 15 for Power weapon :P

hes expensive! :eek:

The Doom Siren is better than the Power Weapon. By a lot. But do as you will is certainly a Slaaneshi family value.