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Chumbalaya
12-17-2009, 11:02 AM
So, here's my first in a series I hope to do about possible ways to run my Orks to keep them at least somewhat competitive.

First up is simple, Battlewagons running down your throat.

HQ
Big Mek-KFF, burna, cybork body, bosspole
Warboss-Powerklaw, cybork body, kombi-skorcha

Elites
Meganobs-5, 2 kombi-skorchas, Battlewagon w/ armor plaes, big shoota, reinforced ram, grot riggers
2x 9 Lootas

Troops
Nobs-6, Painboy, cybork bodies, 2 powerklaws, Waagh! Banner, 2 kombi-skorchas, bosspole (all mixed up to be unique, cuz I'm an *******), Battlewagon w/ armor plates, big shoota, reinforced ram, grot riggers
Shoota Boyz-20, 2 big shootas, Nob w/ powerklaw, bosspole
Slugga Boyz-19, Nob w/ powerklaw, bosspole
Grots-12, runtherd

Fast Attack
Deff Kopta-rokkitz, buzzsaw
2x 2 Buggies-rokkitsz

Heavy Support
2x Battlewagons-armor plates, big shoota, grot riggers, reinforced ram

2000 even.

So, we've got 4 wagons full of ornery Orks ready to stomp on your throat and call it a day. The tricky part is getting there. Battlewagons are deceptive, they look great on paper with AV14, but open-topped and the super narrow model basically turns it into a 4th edition vehicle with AV12 after turn 1. It's almost impossible for them to block for each other because of the shape of the model, so you're going from AV14 to open-topped AV12 quite rapidly. The KFF mitigates it, but once you get into melta range it's pretty much over.

Still, 40 Orks and 2 units of Nobs can break the backs of most anything. The Boss and Big Mek are no slouches either. The former rides with the Sluggas to give them a little extra oomph, while the Big Mek has to babysit the Meganobs. I gave him a burna so he can protect them better by dishing out 4 S5 I4 power weapon attacks on the charge. Shootas will usually stay mounted and blast infantry, but they can hold their own in assault too.

To back that up, I have my Kopta ready to turn 1 pop a vehicle or outflank and annoy. Buggies are cheap, mobile firepower, and Lootas can down light armor from across the board. Having them on foot can cause problems, mostly from LoS blocking Battlewagons, but since I didn't max out to 15 I can find them a good spot to chill most of the time.

Thoughts?

Blog post here: http://bnhblog.blogspot.com/2009/12/umpteenth-look-orks-army-list-colon-1.html

Lord Azaghul
12-17-2009, 11:09 AM
I like it, it looks both fun to play and fun to play against. I think the large groups of boyz and the Battlewagons will make target priority a tricky decision. A few of those hits on the wagons from should still be against AV14, and those will be early and probably ranged.

Jwolf
12-18-2009, 08:29 PM
I'm not a fan of 4 Battlewagons, because it is just so easy to take them down on turn 2. After the Boyz are out, the number of bodies is insufficient to deal with most forces, especially because there are only 5 possible assault entities (assuming that the Big Mek is not racing out to assault anything, ever). The Deffkoptas are okay for smacking a tank, maybe 2, but they aren't important are terribly useful to you.

Bulwark uses a lot of Stormboyz along with 2 Battlewagons, and this seems to give him a fairly horrific amount of smacking into the lines across a broad front on turn 2.

Meganobz are not good for a competitive force, in my opinion. There is simply too much AP2 blast available in IG and SM forces for them to do well.

Chumbalaya
12-20-2009, 11:00 PM
Nah, Meganobs are pretty poor, I'm just trying to make the most of what I've got.

I could double up on the Nob units, drop the Sluggas and their wagon, stick Lootas in the empty wagons, and go from there. I'm up to 5 wagons, but only 3 of them are being aggressive, the Lootas just sit in their protection.

Jwolf
12-21-2009, 08:43 AM
Battlewagons make great Loota Bunkers, since they sit with their AV14 facing the enemy instead of moving into flank shot land. And lots of people will shoot at those Loota Battlewagons on turn 1, which helps the aggressive units not get an unfortunate result. (I shoot everything at the Mek's Battlewagon, hoping for Immobilized, but many people fear Lootas, for some odd reason).

I think getting smaller on Boyz reduces your effectiveness, but if you're not wanting to paint a lot more boyz (price can't be the issue, 60 AoBR Boyz cost less than a cheesburger around here), then I think the Loota Wagons are a pretty solid way to cause a lot of standard Mech players to help you beat them.

Chumbalaya
12-21-2009, 11:28 AM
I only have so many slots for Battlewagons, that's the big problem. I don't like Trukk boyz either since they're just so ineffectual. Finding a balance is the tricky part.

mercer
12-23-2009, 06:05 AM
Ahhh my fellow Ork disser lol.

Your big mek doesn't really need a boss pole as the nob in the boyz mob the mek will go with has a boss pole already, and you can't re-roll leaderships twice due to the two boss poles. So one is wasted.

No attack squig on the boss? Having 6 S10 power weapon attacks on the charge is nasty business. Worth the 15 points.

Megannobz aren't that mega. The big mek won't really protect them as they'll be inside the wagon, and once that pops their armour save is better than the 2+ cover save. In combat the big mek won't help them as cover saves don't apply in combat. Best thing to do is get mad dok and put him with the meganobz and give them cybork bodies ;) . You're only losing the KFF, which I don't think is a massive benefit.

At least 10 lootas. Lootas are easy to kill, I would add more really to stop them running away.

Nobz look ok but do you really need armour plates & grot riggers? I don't think so. The plates just reduce crew stunned to shaken and grots 4+ on immobilised, I don't think all that is needed to keep it going. Probably just grot riggers if anything as the wagon is open topped so +1 on the vehicle damage chart.

One deffkopter? Meh. Deffkopters are better than buggies because they can turbo boost, get a cover save, move over terrain without any problems and have scout. The buggy is a tiny little bit more durable, but being open topped means its easy to take out. I would go kopters only, in seperate units. Not to mention your weak buggies on in squadrons, bad idea as this will make them weaker.

Chumbalaya
12-23-2009, 11:36 AM
Oh, the Mek is rolling with the Meganoobs, which is why he's got a bosspole and is kitted out for combat. Not perfect, but I really want to use my Meganoobs :P

I picked up 9 Lootas mostly to keep costs down while still having plenty of firepower. If I had points I'd go higher.

I generally pick up the riggers and plates to keep the Battlewagons rolling, which is their only job. Normally I wouldn't shell out, but on the important ones I feel it is very useful.

I like Koptaz, but with bugs around the corner (and tons of nid players waiting with baited breath), I don't see much use for them beyond alpha striking a tank. They aren't going to hold anything up in combat and I can just pick up 2 Buggies instead for double the firepower, 2 vehicles that can block movement and take up space as needed.

I have been doing some thinking and I'm considering going for a more balanced approach. Wagons still rush, but I'll support them with Lootas/Big Gunz covered by Gretchin bubblewrap, buggies, and whatever else I can fit. I may go for 2 units of Nobs and be done with it, supporting them with the shoota wagon. I really like Grots and Buggies are cheap units to take up space, so I'll try and work more in.

PhatCat
12-23-2009, 11:53 AM
Regular nobz are SO MUCH BETTER than meganobz it's not even funny. The wound allocation, feel no pain, diversified gear nobz are much more versatile, and you can still have 3-5 power klaws in there for vehicle wrecking and insta-kill.

Have you considered having the battlewagon full of burnas as an option? 15 burna templates is nasty and would fill a hole in your roster for dealing with hordes.

If you really want the lootas, maybe take just one unit, max size, and put them in a "gunship" style battlewagon with kannons (not killkannon since you can't shoot anything else) and rokkit launchas. The battlewagon and lootas don't have to shoot at same unit, so you still get plenty of dakka flying from that general location and will definitely take some attention from your charging mob.

The deffkopta/buggies question is one that I consider often, and I usually take koptas for the scout move and shot at a turn one shot/charge against a vehicle (I use TL rokkits and a buzzsaw). But I think rokkit buggies have their uses as well, and frankly, both will generally do alright. That's a personal preference thing.

Overall, having run similar lists, I think you have a good one. At this point, I suggest you playtest and see what you like and what works consistently for you against different opponents. Having the loota unit will be something you need to analyze a bit, because it is static while the rest of your army surges forward. If you have the points and decide to keep the loota firebase, you might give it a grot escort to circle the wagon and protect it from assault.

Good luck!

Pariah Stevo
12-31-2009, 01:43 AM
i ran and ork list similar to yours. I always found that it lacked teeth, and was far too squishy. I love meganobs. most people under-estimate them because they don't look at their cost compared to regular nobs. they are cheaper, and more destructive. i love my rokkit buggies, i mean i love'em but at the end of the day they are just too unreliable, 3 deffcoptas with rokkits are much more viable, with outflank or turboboosting scout moves. that is alot of lootas. i think you will have a problem creating fire lanes with them. i mean, you will have four battle wagons trying to get there asap. i would just take one squad and make it larger, no smaller than twelve. i would also make your nobs squad a 10 man squad, cuz it gets nasty at that point. you want that squad to be able to take a licking and still be a threat. At least that is what i would do with this army. Like i said, i play a similar army, and my answer was...NOB BIKERS...i know, tooo cheesy you say? Tyranids will now be able to deepstrike and drop pod, hop out and shoot 3 S10 AP1 lance weapons. trust me, nob bikers arent that bad, if it makes you feel better i had the whole bunch die on me at the bottom of the first turn once. But seriously, they work great in this kind of army because the weapon made to kill the BW'S are the same that are used to insta kill the bikers. it makes your opponent split fire, which he can't do , but he just simply can't ignore one part of you army, if he drops your transport he has to deal with 10 bikers up his butt while the boyz/MANZ catch up and if he focuses enough to stop the bike then all you transports get there. win win baby

BuFFo
12-31-2009, 01:49 AM
At 2000 points, there is no reason NOT to have 2x 15 Lootas.