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View Full Version : Using leman russes in squadrons



crazyredpraetorian
07-24-2009, 12:00 PM
I personally don't use more than 3 russes. So, I don't use squadrons. Do you use squadrons of Leman Russes or do you believe that the Russ is better on it's own?

Madigan
07-24-2009, 12:18 PM
I only use squadrons of Russes in large point games (2000+) where I actually have enough points to reasonably afford more than three.

So far I have mixed feelings about them, though. Loosing a 180+ point vehicle to a failed difficult terrain test is incredibly upsetting, so much so that I almost find it worth it to pay 10 points a tank for dozer blades. Especially on Demolisher tanks since I tend to move them around a lot more.

One great thing I've found about Russ squadrons is that if you have, say, two Leman Russ Battle Tanks in a squadron and one takes a glancing hit, shaking it, it can pop smoke without preventing its squadmate from shooting. Then, because the squadron is "50% obscured" due to the smoke, both tanks get a cover save, even out in the open. And since only one tank used its smoke launchers, you can do this sort of thing twice a game if the need arrises.

Jwolf
07-24-2009, 12:21 PM
That is a nice trick, and one that applies particularly well to Hellhounds. Using the cover to get them across the board and into challenge range of opposing objectives is good times.

Demosthenes
07-24-2009, 05:25 PM
With all the squads running around now with multiple melta guns, I think squadrons are very dangerous for the owner.

The melta guns just have to be within 6 inches of one to be able to frag all of em. I've had more than one game in which my obliterators deep strike next to one and end up blowing all three of em' up. With immobilized results counting as destroyed and the AP 1 bonus, you only need to roll 3+'s to destroy each vehicle.

crazyredpraetorian
07-24-2009, 09:32 PM
With all the squads running around now with multiple melta guns, I think squadrons are very dangerous for the owner.

The melta guns just have to be within 6 inches of one to be able to frag all of em. I've had more than one game in which my obliterators deep strike next to one and end up blowing all three of em' up. With immobilized results counting as destroyed and the AP 1 bonus, you only need to roll 3+'s to destroy each vehicle.

That is exactly why I don't use them.

mkerr
07-25-2009, 10:10 AM
With all the squads running around now with multiple melta guns, I think squadrons are very dangerous for the owner.

I agree. The ubiquitousness of 2-3 meltas in fast (or deep striking) units makes tank squadrons almost unplayable. I can't think of the last Space Marine or Imperial Guard army that I played that didn't have one of these tank buster squads.

So you either have to go nuts with LR squadrons (three squadrons of two tanks, for example) or you have to exclude LR squadrons.

Hellhound squadrons are still pretty effective though. Their speed allows you to get at least one turn of effectiveness before they get jumped by special weapon squads.

-- mkerr

Oldgrue
07-31-2009, 04:31 PM
I don't think the Russ is really an anti-armor role anymore. Its more of a slow moving anti-infantry firepoint.
The russ is heavily armored enough to risk showing its side so it can block a lot of line of sight, can move and fire its turret, and can reach as far as most artillery.

Since its not an anti-armor role, the squadrons aren't really effective for Russes.

GPrime
07-31-2009, 05:31 PM
I dont think they are effective due to the above reasons.

The only time i use a squadron is to outflank 2-3 demolishers with creed

Valdore
07-31-2009, 07:00 PM
So far, there is only one army that I've found that I would happily use squadrons against, and that is necrons. Because fifth ed nerfed the gauss rule so much, having a vehicle destroyed when immobilised isn't that much of a loss. I have had a squadron of russes sat next to a monolith which was pounding into them for several turns, often getting multiple hits, but on a 6 to glance and a 6 to immobilise(destroy) Squadrons stand a fair old chance :)

However, against other armies, I would likely only use squadrons if I needed the firepower, go with the base vehicles, no upgrades, and spend the upgrade points on more tanks. The thing I always find myself forgetting is that tanks are great fire magnets for protecting those oh so vulnerable infantry that you need to hold the objectives ;) So in some cases, the more the better.

crazyredpraetorian
07-31-2009, 07:14 PM
I squadroned a pair of Hydras last night to pretty good effect. But, they didn't take very many hits. So, I'm still leaning against squadrons.

Brennen
07-31-2009, 07:41 PM
I don't like putting my LRBTs in squadrons, but I do take my Bassie's in a squadron. Damn effect that way too. I run my Hellhounds (I love my Hellhounds) in a squadron of two. Since I have a Vendetta and a Valkyrie taking up the other two Fast attack slots, I have to put the HH's like that. I've had reasonably good luck with them like that too...

CKO
07-31-2009, 09:07 PM
No one mentioned that all the tanks have to shoot at the same target, or how artillery changes.

N-Bomb
07-31-2009, 09:13 PM
I, like many, have a love-hate relationship with squadrons. On one side its nice for cover, save up slots (although I haven't given much trial to the other heavy supports), and my favorite allocating wounds. Although it is easier to blow up them, the nice thing is if I have say a cheap battle cannon in a squadron with an executioner, obviously more expensive, its nice to let the battle cannon take as many hits as it can before destruction, letting me be more gutsy with the executioner.

Lord Severus
07-31-2009, 09:17 PM
In my Ardboys list I used a Executioner, a squad of 2 demolishers, and a squad of 2 naked leman russes. I had great succes. While the Executioner is by far my now favorite leman russ, the squadrons performed awesomely. The Demolishers hung out with my inquistor and mystics and protected my guard lines, while the leman russes with just hull heavy bolters moved with my advancing chimeras and provided them with support. Granted I had 8 chimeras so I was able to protect them from the sides and front from deepstrikers and melta rushes, but they still performed great. I think they are only viable in large games, but then at that many points you also run into that many more melta units. I think they have advantages and disadvantages.

edit: I also did fairly well, and finished third in the prelims.

Lord Inquisitor
07-31-2009, 09:22 PM
If you have enough points to take 3 heavy support choices. Take 3 Russes or Artillary tanks. Then dump all the rest of you points into good ole Guardsmen. All praise the might of many Guardsmen!

Emperorsmercy
08-03-2009, 01:58 AM
I am a slight extremist, but I take 2 squadrons of Leman Russ Punishers. Thats 120 strength 5 shots. they are very expensive, and I only use them in 1750+ games, but if they are used cleverly they can bring down anything you wish due to the amazing rate of fire. So I am for squadrons.

StrikerFox
08-03-2009, 04:46 AM
my friend uses 3 basilisks in a squadron, so he can get the whole multiple barrage thing going for a turn or two. of course he does have to think about whether or not its worth taking them in a squadron or not.. but for the most part, he just likes droppin f bombs on his opponents trying to close in on him.. XD

Majorcrash
08-03-2009, 12:33 PM
I currently field 2 sqaudrons of russ's, one that is static and covers parts of the table and the other that advances with my platoon. This combo of Russ and Vanquisher, then Russ and Executioner spells doom to most Marine armies. Now I am very carefull of maruding cls asslt squads. But by adding Plasma cannon sponsons to the vanquiser. All is good.

Majorcrash
08-03-2009, 12:35 PM
If you have enough points to take 3 heavy support choices. Take 3 Russes or Artillary tanks. Then dump all the rest of you points into good ole Guardsmen. All praise the might of many Guardsmen!

Amen Brother, Sing it

RocketRollRebel
08-03-2009, 12:41 PM
Ive been toying with the idea and tried it out a few times. So far I haven't been that impressed. Its an extremely fragile unit to CC to the point where a lone Lictor took out both of my LRBT's on the charge. I made sure to keep them moving but 4+ to hit isnt really saving them all that much.

I do think hellhounds (all variants) can work nicely in squadrons as can hydras but Russ's in squads I'm going to have to say nay to.

Mortarion
08-03-2009, 01:00 PM
I agree with the folks that say you need to go all or nothing with LR squadrons. I think that using them in squadrons is always a gamble, because you either get lucky and dominate the game because the opponent doesn't have enough anti tank weaponry to deal with you quickly enough, or you suffer as he destroys half of your army in a couple of turns. I've seen it go both ways, but overall, I wouldn't recommend them, 3 LR's is enough for an all-comer's list, spend those points on hellhounds and all the other goodness instead ;)