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MrMike85
08-05-2009, 12:42 AM
So I just started to play Eldar and having problems. Any helpful ideas to make a great list?:confused:

Rookie1
08-05-2009, 01:34 AM
Start with units, which you like.
Go for fluff, not for being competitive. The hobby is all about fun, and when you paint models you should like them.
Play some games to get a feeling for the game.

To make great list you could start reading army analysis and discussions about them. Dakka has some hintful articles (http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Category:Eldar_Tactica).
Try typing eldar and some keywords in the search engine on the main BOLS site.
Try type "truth necrons" into google. The first entry is imo very useful.

RealGenius
08-05-2009, 07:31 AM
So I just started to play Eldar and having problems. Any helpful ideas to make a great list?:confused:
Play more.

No one starts out as a great general with a new army. My best advice is to keep losing: when you start beating that person regularly, find someone better to play so you can start losing again.

Brass Scorpion
08-05-2009, 07:51 AM
Eldar tactics are like any other army in 40K, but what makes them unique is their specialization. Unlike Space Marines of any type which can do nearly anything at least modestly well, Eldar troops are highly specialized. Assault units are only good for that, fire support is only good for that, and so on, so it is extremely important to have your specialists performing only the role they were designed for in most situations. Other than that, the same general tactics apply as to any othe army, which is to say that assault troops need to have good covering fire support from behind as they advance, use cover as they advance, shooting units should have a good field of fire and cover if possible, etc.

It's also important to take advantage of special abilities. For example, Warp Spiders can potentially jump back into cover after they shoot, so be sure to do so whenever possible.

Finally, as with any 40K army, go for the mismatch when attacking. Enemy units that are hard to deal with in assault should be blasted in the shooting phase while enemy units that can be overwhelmed by assault specialists should be assaulted at the earliest opportunity, especially if it will keep them from shooting or assaulting your weaker units.

MrMike85
08-06-2009, 02:14 AM
Thanks! My one big problem right now is being outnumbered and having so few models on the board that if anyone takes out a tank my army gets crippled and cant recover.

BuFFo
08-06-2009, 02:15 AM
Thanks! My one big problem right now is being outnumbered and having so few models on the board that if anyone takes out a tank my army gets crippled and cant recover.

Get used to that. You are Eldar after all :)

Rookie1
08-06-2009, 03:47 AM
Thanks! My one big problem right now is being outnumbered and having so few models on the board that if anyone takes out a tank my army gets crippled and cant recover.
Strike first. With the high Ini value you should always attack first in CC.
Calculate in your head how many attacks you have and how many will wound, S3 is sometimes a bargain.

As mentioned before, Eldar are specialized. But you have a large amount of different weapons for killing infantry, tanks and everything.

I play Eldar and Orks. Prefer Eldar. I like the high Ini, so I hit first and can calculate.
Orks mostly have to take the first punch and it is not easy to guess how many will survive for striking back.

User cover, know your chances and you will suceed. ;)

DaRaKur
08-06-2009, 06:55 AM
I started Eldar by buying a whole lot of units and seeing how they work. End of the day you have 2 core types of army with a whole bunch of hybrids inbetween.

First is the infantry gun line. Static army on foot holding ground with some strike force added for counter attack or behind the scenes sneakiness.

Second is a fully mobile army, based on Falcons, WaveSerpents, Jetbikes etc. This is my preference. Add in Eldrad with Divination and use your speed and flexibility to concentrate on one flank of your opponent. I usually manage to work down the one flank and then roll my opponent up, using harlequins out of the Falcons as strike troops to mop up with dire avengers using Bladestorm, Doom and Guide to destroy any large infantry unit in the way.

Friend of mine uses a fully mobile army of jetbikes, warlocks, 2 farseers and 2 Falcons. I don't think its as effective as my combo, but it does well

TheKingElessar
08-06-2009, 06:58 AM
Fully Mechanised lists for Eldar are great. Foot lists suck harder than most other Foot lists, because you're expensive, and T3.

Always remember, MindWar FTW (http://hobbyinfobythekingelessar.blogspot.com)!

keithsilva
08-06-2009, 01:50 PM
Get used to being wounded alot T3 doesnt stand up to much. I have been playing Eldar for a while used them the Ards boys got 6th place. I takes time to get a handle on them just perpare to lose alot of games first off, it will help u built a strong list. When u do a list picture what u want every unit to do, and go after. Eldar of really good troops. Also go with alot of S6 weapons, yeah there AP is not great but that will not matter when u are wounding on 2 most of the time. I use scatter lasers, cannons, bright lance ( for those landraiders) and missle launchers (the best when use S4 AP4 pinning aganist swarms). I have a good 1750, 2000, and 2500 list, if you want I can give you some pointers.;)

Majorcrash
08-06-2009, 02:22 PM
I dont use much in the way of aspect warriors. Just now trying out reapers. but large numbers of guardians on the move with a starcannon or two is powerful. Harliquens for counterpunch (they move thru cover) Dire avengers for sheer fire power. Plus i like the tanks, even the transports are better than most other races MBT's. Eldar require a litte paitence to play cant just run and get stuck in. First you tenderize the target then you select juicy bit to bite off. If a big nasty unit come at you run away. Most races will never catch you. And remeber many of your weapon have good AP and Str. :rolleyes:

Herald of Nurgle
08-06-2009, 02:27 PM
S
T
S

Speed
Time
Space

Those are your weapons with Eldar. Use the Space - fill it with your Speed. Then use Time with said Speed to get to the Space you need to be in

Rookie1
08-06-2009, 02:36 PM
Maugan Ra/Jain Zar, Farseer, Harlies, Fire dragons, Serpents.
After this I look how many points I have left to spend on Dire Avengers and other troops to wipe out the leftovers. :)

MrMike85
08-08-2009, 02:45 AM
Well everyone, been playing more and came up with a problem. Should i go Scorpions for higher str and survivability or Banshees for power weapons and strike first (usually)?

Both have done really good but only have room for one. What are your thoughts?

Rookie1
08-08-2009, 05:58 AM
Well everyone, been playing more and came up with a problem. Should i go Scorpions for higher str and survivability or Banshees for power weapons and strike first (usually)?

Both have done really good but only have room for one. What are your thoughts?
I like to quote Majorcrash from my penalty box thread (http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=453). We had a short discussion about scorpions and if they are worth taken with S4 and 3+ save.
Compared to harlies they rather get benched.
Take harlies. They excel banshees all the time. Especially when combined with Jain Zar and a Farseer (Stupid Eldar Trick 317).


My Eldar force is formed around 2-3 squads of guardians with added DAvengers and counterpunch of Harliquiens. Firedragons are a must. But banshees and scorpions are few in number and only good for one hit and then mowed down. at thier cost i would rather have another large unit of guardians or some vehicles. I am currently trying out reapers but havent made up my mind. The wraithguard are just to pricey even though i like them. and the wraithlord, is not as good buy as a Fprism or a falcon. Plus I think of the wraithlord as more of a theme unit. (just me). warwalkers are a must with a farseer to assist.

avatar8481
08-10-2009, 10:49 AM
Try type "truth necrons" into google. The first entry is imo very useful


Clever way to beat the BOLS filter...I like it.

Skitter Leap
08-10-2009, 01:17 PM
Harlequins have uses in an all foot slogging army but if you plan to have a mixed mechanized or full mechanized they are out performed by scorpions and banshees. Overall I banshees and scorpions do the same job harlequins do but for less points. Banshees are great at fighting power armoured armies while scorpions excel at fighting horde armies but still perform against power armour with reasonable success. The real key to these units is supporting them with a farseer that has doom and fortune.

Nabterayl
08-10-2009, 01:33 PM
I'll add that numbers matter when you have the Initiative advantage. To give an example, take five striking scorpions including an exarch with chainsabres (not necessarily the best set-up for what's about to follow, but bear with me; I'm deliberately outfitting them poorly for what follows). Have them charge ten Chaos space marines including a champion with a power fist (not the easiest thing in the world to do, but doable with a wave serpent, and again, I'm making a point).

Those five scorpions expect to kill 4 CSM. The surviving six CSM kill 2 striking scorpions, leaving two scorpions and the exarch to face six CSM assuming the CSM don't run (roughly 72% chance to stand their ground absent other factors). Even if the scorpions win, that unit is done.

Now take ten scorpions including an exarch with chainsabres and have them charge the ten Chaos space marines. The scorpions expect to kill 8 CSM and lose one of their own. Big difference. Having the Initiative advantage in close combat allows you to punch out whole enemy units with relative impunity if you're willing to invest in the numbers to do so.

MrMike85
08-12-2009, 01:32 AM
thanks i will defiantly look at the harlequins.

Rookie1
08-12-2009, 03:53 AM
thanks i will defiantly look at the harlequins.
Some advices. You should take:
Kisses
2x fusion pistols
Shadowseer

Troupe Master and Death Jester are not a must. Personally I like the troupe master.
As mentioned before Jain Zar or Maugan Ra and/or a Farseer are a powerful addition.

scadugenga
08-12-2009, 06:07 AM
While I may not be able to take credit for tourney or 'ard boyz wins (I don't tourney-play much--mostly because I'm more of a player and less of a painter) I have been playing Eldar for 20 years.

Gyah. 20 years...


Okay, back to point--the first and foremost lesson to learn when playing eldar is this:

You must, MUST dictate the pace of the battle. You will almost always be outnumbered, but no other army has the flexibility and mobility of the eldar. Regardless of how badly you are outgunned, if you make your opponent react to your plans rather than acting on his own--you are well on your way to victory.

As for Scorps vs. Banshees--take your pick. Personally, I prefer Scorpions over Banshees and have since the early 90's. ;) Mostly due to the fluff and the sculpts. (Less said about 3rd ed Scorpion sculpts the better...)

Banshees have a slight advantage over Scorps against MEQ. Scorps are more durable, however, and can have an ungodly number of attacks in cc--and I"m more a fan of the "law of large numbers."

Harlequins are great, but fire magnets. 5+ invuln is okay, but not great, and flamers just plain hurt.

Experiment with what works for you--and definitely don't feel you need to take "mandatory units." The Eldar 'dex is specialized enough that you can customize your army the way you like.

Cheers,

S.

TheKingElessar
08-12-2009, 06:15 AM
Wonder where you got that idea... ;)

Also, this article (http://raptor1313.blogspot.com/2009/08/eldar-elite-melee-choices-evaluated.html) could be useful.

Majorcrash
08-12-2009, 07:47 AM
"Harlequins are great, but fire magnets. 5+ invuln is okay, but not great, and flamers just plain hurt."

Its true after the first time you Harliquins wipe some rather expensive unit, they draw more fire then you can believe. but thats not a bad thing either. WIth thier ability to move thru terrain, and the shadow seers veil of tears. Most likely they will get across the table and eat something. I try to use them as a counter punch. Find the biggest badest unit my oponnent has and manuver close. When he jumps one of my guardians then the Harliquins pounce. between fleet and move thru cover..........:D. Shadow seers are a must, death jesters for fun if you have the points, troupe leader if you have the points, pwr sword is usefull addition.

scadugenga
08-12-2009, 05:48 PM
"Harlequins are great, but fire magnets. 5+ invuln is okay, but not great, and flamers just plain hurt."

Its true after the first time you Harliquins wipe some rather expensive unit, they draw more fire then you can believe. but thats not a bad thing either. WIth thier ability to move thru terrain, and the shadow seers veil of tears. Most likely they will get across the table and eat something. I try to use them as a counter punch. Find the biggest badest unit my oponnent has and manuver close. When he jumps one of my guardians then the Harliquins pounce. between fleet and move thru cover..........:D. Shadow seers are a must, death jesters for fun if you have the points, troupe leader if you have the points, pwr sword is usefull addition.

I couldn't agree more re: SS and TL--I never leave home without them--and frequently add in the DJ--because I'm old-school like that. ;P I've just experienced that the moment the Harlies hit the field, they attract fire (mostly pie plates) like mad. Fortunately they're 5+ invuln, and not 5+ cover...

Though it is a bit sad that the sight of a Death Jester no longer brings out whimpering and cowering from my opponents...

vman
08-13-2009, 02:26 AM
I love eldar so much

Majorcrash
08-13-2009, 07:01 AM
sometimes in the dark recsess of my soul, I remember the fun that was a solitare. kiss with neural blaster, 3+ invul (i think it was) Take a blood thirster down in one round.:D