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pgarfunkle
03-28-2010, 06:05 AM
After having the chance to read through the new codex I was thinking about how the new rules would affect my army list.

I've always enjoyed fielding large numbers of jump pack troops but having to run them across the board can lead to high numbers of casualties from enemy shooting and my poor rolling on difficult terrain tests. Now with descent of angels making deep striking more reliable and Sanguinary priest conferring FNP on nearby squads they should prove more hardy.

In addition Death company troops are now optional (OK so they were optional in the pdf but technically you were still paying for them whether you took them or not) will we see fewer death company troops on the board. Or with the options for combat weapons they now have will we see larger tooled up squads?

I've always loved dreadnoughts but never really seem to field any, they are usually the first thing to get cut from my lists when I realise I've over spent. However after reading the new rules for the Furioso I'm seriously considering fielding at least one armed with blood claws in a drop pod or hanging off the back of a Storm Raven if and when GW get around to producing a model.

I'm curious what anybody else who has had a chance to read the codex thinks. How do you think it will affect the army you field or, for the enemies of the sons of sanguinius, how do you think it will affect what you see on the other side of the table?

gcsmith
03-28-2010, 06:24 AM
DC are distraction and hold units, not hammer blow units in my opinion, Im hoping to do a skitarii army based on BA list due to tanks and they seem to be their to be annoying and tie up to help u deal the killing blow

pgarfunkle
03-28-2010, 07:00 AM
I've always used them as such too but with the addition of a few power weapons and the new version of litanies of hate which allows you to re-roll missed hits and failed wounds they could be pretty powerful. They took care of a berserker squad pretty handily in this months issue of WD and if they hadn't been pounced on by Abbadon I think they would have been good to go for more.

So you'll be going for a tank heavy list then? Will you be taking advantage of the Deep Striking Land Raiders? Could be a very tense scatter role lol

gcsmith
03-28-2010, 07:03 AM
nope current idea is scouts, libby and assult in rhino, 2 dreads in stormraven and other things :p

pgarfunkle
03-28-2010, 07:29 AM
Yeah the idea of Furioso Dreads in Storm Ravens really appeal to me at the moment.

Other things? Does this mean that the Ad Mech will finally be getting their hands on a Baal Predator lol?

CaptainSinon
03-28-2010, 09:49 AM
im gonna be running a list with sanguinor dante 3 units of sanguinary guard with accompanying sanguinary priest (slightly depressing that with a few extras that comes to 1500 points but oh well)

gcsmith
03-28-2010, 09:50 AM
they have had it for years, they need make it dnt they??? and anyway who better to test the proto storm raven :p

pgarfunkle
03-28-2010, 11:41 AM
No the Ad Mech don't have the plans for the Baal. The STC it was based on was recovered by the Blood Angels around the time of the Great Crusade, I think. They took it back to Baal and didn't share it with anyone other than their successors.

@ Captainsinon. Let me know that goes. Should be pretty mean in combat but getting there is going to be hard

P.S. I've just spotted it was a Thousand Son squad not the Berserkers that the Death Company tore through.

Tynskel
03-28-2010, 05:59 PM
I have been reading through the dex.

I am excited to see how the codex is balanced!

Predator Annihilators are ~180 points! But are FAST!

Deep Striking a Land Raider is really cool, but you will need a locator Beacon to ensure proper placement.

Watch out for Hydras if you field a Storm Raven, they'll chew it to pieces.


Interesting side note: there are no Terminator Armored Special Characters. If you want a terminator hero, ya gotta make your own. What is nice, though, is the Sanguinary Priest can take Terminator Armor again! (Feel No Pain, Furious Charge Terminators! w00t!)

Here's a basic list I am thinking about...

HQ
Master Garibaldi
Terminator Captain w/ Lightning Claws

TROOPS
Death Company
~5-7 Marines, Power Weapon, Powerfist
Dedicated Transport: Rhino
Callistar, the Determined
Death Co. Dread, Hv Flamer, Magna Grapple
Dedicated Transport: Drop Pod, Locator Beacon, Deathwind Launcher
Tactical Squad Sol
10 Marines, Combi-melta, Powerfist, Teleport Homer, Meltagun
Dedicated Transport: Razorback, Assault Cannons
Assault Squad Luna
10 Marines, Hand Flamers (3), Power Weapon
Dedicated Transport: Rhino

ELITES
Sanguinary Priest Shaharrim
Priest, Terminator Armor
Codicer Leximarti
Furioso, Librarian, Frag Launcher, Extra Armor, Magna Grapple, Blood Lance, Wings of Sanguinius
Terminator Squad Tenacious
10 Terminators, Hv Flamer, Assault Cannon
Dedicated Transport: Land Raider Redeemer, Extra Armor, Multi-melta

Hv SUPPORT
Vindicator
Siege Shield
Pred Destuctor
Lascannon Sponsons
Pred Destructor
Lascannon Sponsons

Tacoo
03-28-2010, 09:18 PM
I think the BA might act sorta like a slower, more resiliant DE. in the sens that i could see 6 razerbacks with no jump pack marines in side and a Las/ tled plas turret on top, while fast vindicators fly around droping shells, and points permitting, Outflanking Baals

pgarfunkle
03-29-2010, 02:16 PM
That's an interesting list Tynskel, I'm thinking of taking a Furioso with Blood Talons and sticking it in a drop pod. I'll probably field 1 or 2 Baal Preds and will play around with the Flamer loadout to see whether I prefer burny or shooty.

I will probably split my troops between jump pack troops and rhino/razorback transports. I'm also thinking of a 5 man death company with a couple of power weapons and maybe a fist and a chaplain to allow the re roll missed hits and failed wounds (I think that any chaplain will do that otherwise I'll go for lemartes).

I'll stick in a couple of sanguinary priests with jump packs to follow the assault troops around and help keep them breathing on their way across the board.

Tynskel
03-29-2010, 04:03 PM
The more I think about them... the more I like the Blood Talons.

Realistically, you want the str 10 for armor. But, most armor will can be ripped apart by St6 6 too- if the Dread has furious charge because of a Priest nearby, Str 7!

A furioso has 5 attacks on the charge. Now imagine the Blood Talons- 5 unsaved wounds grants another 5 attacks. (granted this is hoping an initial 5 attacks with no misses...). Throw in the Meltagun, and a Hv Flamer (maybe even a magna grapple), and you have a Dreadnought that can wipe out a tactical squad by itself!

The Storm Raven is pretty sweet gig, expensive, but sweet- putting a Blood Talon Dreadnought on board could be exciting. Because of the Assault Ramps, granting the Dreadnought the ability to charge the turn it disembarks will be NASTY- no chance for someone to knock one of those Blood Talon arms off.

Blood Talon Arms only grant the extra attacks if you have 2 functioning. So, when you lose an arm, you are not just losing 1 attack, but a potential up 6 attacks. OUCH!

Bloodboy
03-29-2010, 11:09 PM
The more I think about them... the more I like the Blood Talons.

Realistically, you want the str 10 for armor. But, most armor will can be ripped apart by St6 6 too- if the Dread has furious charge because of a Priest nearby, Str 7!

A furioso has 5 attacks on the charge. Now imagine the Blood Talons- 5 unsaved wounds grants another 5 attacks. (granted this is hoping an initial 5 attacks with no misses...). Throw in the Meltagun, and a Hv Flamer (maybe even a magna grapple), and you have a Dreadnought that can wipe out a tactical squad by itself!

The Storm Raven is pretty sweet gig, expensive, but sweet- putting a Blood Talon Dreadnought on board could be exciting. Because of the Assault Ramps, granting the Dreadnought the ability to charge the turn it disembarks will be NASTY- no chance for someone to knock one of those Blood Talon arms off.

Blood Talon Arms only grant the extra attacks if you have 2 functioning. So, when you lose an arm, you are not just losing 1 attack, but a potential up 6 attacks. OUCH!

I saw the codex and the Storm Raven cost ~200 pts.

pgarfunkle
03-30-2010, 12:12 AM
The Furioso is also WS so you will be hitting most things on a 3+ and if I remember correctly the extra attacks are also capable of generating extra wounds. That is if I wasn't getting giddy from reading the rules but the staffer I was talking to read the rules too and came to the same conclusion.

You are right though as soon as an arm comes off the benefit is lost, so will just have to keep it from being shot too much and FA 13 should help in that regard.

Tynskel
03-30-2010, 02:27 AM
I believe both the Furioso and the Death Company Dreadnoughts have enhanced WS (although the Furioso is higher!)

The flat stormraven is ~200, but with all the doodads n' stuff, can get upwards ~300!! But, at that point, By itself, it can lay waste to an army, if not dealt with.

How the Blood Talons work is that 1) they are Lightning Claws (str 6) 2) you get an extra Attack for every unsaved wound, the new attacks do not generate bonus attacks (as long as you have a pair).

So a furioso having, say, 5 attacks on the charge could potentially do 10 wounds.

pgarfunkle
03-30-2010, 05:16 AM
Huh I had though the new attacks were able to generate new wounds, must have mis read it in my glee lol

Skeletay
04-03-2010, 04:57 PM
The extra attacks do generate more extra attacks.

Tynskel
04-04-2010, 01:38 AM
yeah, I was wrong about the extra attack with Blood Talons. I misread the dex....