End Times: Glottkin Ending

This is obviously a SPOILER thread.

At the very end of End Times: Glottkin, we see Karl Franz reborn by the power of the twin-tailed comet, a shining beacon of light wielding a glowing incarnation of Ghal Maraz. This leads me to believe that he is no longer really Karl Franz but is basically Sigmar Reborn. However, that isn't what I am interested in - though it leads on to my next point.

After the bit with Karl Franz and Nurgle trapping the Glottkin brothers in three jars, we read a conversation between Archaeon and Fateweaver just after Franz learns that Archaeon is finally making his move. The conversation is basically just an affirmation of all the death we know is to come, but Fateweaver makes a curious comment in the last sentence.

After Archaeon states that he does not fear Karl Franz, Fateweaver pointedly says "It is no mortal man that you should fear...."

Is this referring to Karl Franz seeing as he is in all likelihood Sigmar Reborn, or is it in reference to another character? We know Nagash is now effectively the God of Death after he consumed Usirian, but with the heavily rumoured title of the Elf End Times book being End Times: Khaine, could this be a hint at Khaine physically walking the earth? The titular character of each End Times book has been the most powerful character in each (at least for most of the book) and received a huge new model to compensate. I don't think Karl Franz - as powerful as he seemingly is - could stop Archaeon, especially with the Empire and Brettonia being all but destroyed by the Glottkin invasion alone. Could this indeed be Khaine that Fateweaver is referring to? Everyone agrees that what Teclis did to Tyrion seems to indicate that Tyrion will draw the Widowmaker, but does this mean Tyrion will become the living avatar of Khaine or - with the aetherworld combining with the physical world - Khaine himself possessing the body of Tyrion and physically walking the earth? While Nagash and Karl Franz seem more alike to demigods and thus are unlikely to stand against Archaeon if he is indeed the Lord of the End Times and the locus of all Chaos' power, Khaine himself would definitely be a competitor - who better to best the most powerful Champion of Chaos than the God of War and Murder?

Thoughts? Another possibility is that Tyrion is remade in the image of Aenarion or imbued with his power (seeing as Morathi believes Tyrion to be Aenarion Reborn and performed a ritual to try and fully make it so) and then transformed into an Avatar of Khaine - remember, there is no known Avatar of Khaine in Warhammer Fantasy.

So when I read it, I felt Karl Franz was still Karl Franz. He is still acting like the Emperor, but has Ascended into Sigmar Chosen maybe.. I don't think we fully know the answer just yet.

However I think it is important to see what they are doing with End times and and notice the themes that they are playing with. They are following the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse from Christian Revelations. If they are following that fully then they have Death (Nagash) Pestilence (Glotkin). If they follow it fully then Khaine would be War and then finally you have either Famine or as most Christian scholars and Wikipedia state Hope or Conquest.

I think your might be right, that Khaine would be the one thing Archaeon has to fear, as he would be "WAR" incarnate. Also look what each book has done. It has united the Undead, united Chaos. If the trend follows and based off what we've read in the two end times books, the elves should be united under Khaine (and I think this means the wood elves will not join their elven fellows as they are so different.) That would leave the Empires of Man to united under one banner. Would that not be Karl Franz... Just a thought to add on to yours.

I'm expecting a Warhammer Avatar of Khaine, wielding the Widowmaker. Who that will be, that I do not know. Could be anyone!

And given what Alarielle was able to do once upon a time (rip the Chaos out of Asavar Kul's steed), I wouldn't rule out something similar happening to Archaon!

Yeah, it could be anyone/thing. In terms of the elves, I'm sure the stick pixies have a role to play and they already have two Demi-gods wandering around, one of them a woman. Malekith is functionally immortal and Malus Darkblade is some elf/daemon thing. My guess is most likely Nagash, the whole end times has been pitched as his return to stop Chaos. Teclis clearly allowed it for this reason and the Chaos powers are obviously worried if they are desperate enough to try and recruit Settra.

Vampires are also not mortal men.

Nor is Settra...

Women aren't men either. But I'm not sure they'd rip off Tolkien quite so blatantly (again).

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Originally Posted by Erik Setzer

Vampires are also not mortal men.

Nor is Settra...

Women aren't men either. But I'm not sure they'd rip off Tolkien quite so blatantly (again).

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To be honest, which fantasy game or background hasn't rip off Tolkien in some form or another? Tolkien help set the standards for fantasy.

I think it would be cool to have a female character to be that "non mortal man". It would be nice to have more female characters in warhammer fantasy.

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Originally Posted by flipchuck

To be honest, which fantasy game or background hasn't rip off Tolkien in some form or another? Tolkien help set the standards for fantasy.

I think it would be cool to have a female character to be that "non mortal man". It would be nice to have more female characters in warhammer fantasy.

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Well, Warhammer got a lot of its early stuff from being pretty blatant at "borrowing" from Tolkien (and I think Citadel made LOTR movies way back in the day, too, so that's kind of funny), so it's not entirely new for them to get inspiration from his work. It just might be hard to make it not so clear when they're now doing games based in Tolkien's worlds.

I'd love to see more good female characters in WFB. I wish GW paid attention to its fan base and would see the cries for such characters. I think the main reason Blizzard did with WoW is because it's obvious there's a lot of female MMORPG players. Not so sure on the numbers with miniatures games, though it's probably being held back a bit by that lack of interesting and/or strong female characters.

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Originally Posted by yoda4982

However I think it is important to see what they are doing with End times and and notice the themes that they are playing with. They are following the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse from Christian Revelations. If they are following that fully then they have Death (Nagash) Pestilence (Glotkin). If they follow it fully then Khaine would be War and then finally you have either Famine or as most Christian scholars and Wikipedia state Hope or Conquest.

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That's incorrect, pestilence is not a horseman. Pestilence is just one of the things wielded by death. The horsemen are, in order:

Conquest (probably the conquest of Christ)
War
Famine
Death

I suppose Chaos could be conquest (albeit in evil form) and Skaven could be famine?

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Originally Posted by Anggul

That's incorrect, pestilence is not a horseman. Pestilence is just one of the things wielded by death. The horsemen are, in order:

Conquest (probably the conquest of Christ)
War
Famine
Death

I suppose Chaos could be conquest (albeit in evil form) and Skaven could be famine?

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Depending on which flavor of Christianity you believe in, there are different monikers for the horsemen. Let try keeping it about the end times books and not religion please. Lore topics get heated enough without the extra tinder of a religious debate as well.