DE fast attack choice? help please.

[geisthammer]

hellions or reavers to support my trueborn in raider w/ archon with webway portal. I will be using trueborn,raider,webway archon to rush those objectives and pop open the portal for 15 wyches and warriors to defend said objective but will they need support from hellions or reavers???


also what unit size should i consider and upgrades and tactics.

[somerandomdude]

Short answer? Reavers. If your anti-tank is strong enough, you can get away with Hellions (they put out a crazy amount of shots + attacks). However, I feel Hellions are (almost) only worth it in a Baron list. They take up the now valuable FA slot, which is where you can find the best (and most plentiful) anti-tank with multiple Heat Lances and/or Haywire Blasters.

Long answer? Neither of those. A WWP is an amazing army for Beastmasters to be a part of. The speed is incredible, and they are crazy efficient with attacks/points. Rending means they scare tanks too. Not sure what point value you're going with, but for 156 points (the price of the typical 6 man dual Heat Lance Reaver squad) you get a 12 model, 28 wound unit with 26 I6 attacks and 24 I5 rending attacks.

Let me say that one more time. For 156 points, you get 28 wounds and 50 attacks on the charge, all of which go before marines.

The obvious downside to this is you'll have to either convert (which can be very fun in case you don't do it often) or wait until models are released.

Going back to your original choices though, like I said it depends on if you think your anti-tank is strong enough. You need those vehicles open when your Wyches show up, otherwise they will die. They're "support" is the ability to be locked in combat as much as possible. Get the vehicles open and put the WWP as close to enemy infantry as possible. Hopefully your Wychs will show up quickly, get locked in assault, and clean-up on their next turn.

What are you running for Heavy Support? Taloi are great coming out of the portal, and Cronos would give you all the support you need. They will give FNP tokens to your Warriors in cover and your Wyches in assault.

[geisthammer]

for HS im running 2 ravagers and a WIP voidraven.
looks like i missed the 2 other fast attack choices..i will give beastmasters a try. what about scourges???

[somerandomdude]

Personally, I love Scourges, in a particular role. Here's how I would break down the FA for Dark Eldar:

Reavers: Great in virtually any list. A melta platform with extended range AND a free Assault move is incredibly powerful. The biggest weakness of infantry meltas are they're slow moving, usually only 1 (other than Fire Dragons/Meltavets), have to get extremely close and they are left exposed to a lot of return firepower. With Reavers, none of those are an issue. You can get two HL for cheap, move 36" when you don't need to shoot, stay an extra 3 inches away and also move 6 away after that. Assuming you were 8 inches from the tank, your free move takes you out of assault range from the insides. Personally I'd never run them with any other weapons though (maybe the Grav-talon to force pinning).

Beastmasters: Great in WWP lists, good in most others. The speed of these guys is incredible. This is the first time I've ever played with Beasts, but after seeing some of the stuff Brent at Strictly Average has done with his Daemons I knew what they were capable of. The "optimum build" is going to be debated all the way until a new codex update, and I think that's what makes them so appealing. Hypothetically, you could have a LD8 unit with 4++ (for combat purposes mostly) T5 to soak up possible instant death wounds, rending, and a whole bunch of spare wounds on birds, that has a 19-24" threat range. Or you can go cheaper and more efficient (like I suggested in the previous post) with 3 BM, 5 Khymerae, and 4 Flocks. You lose the ID protection but you keep things cheap and you still throw out a lot of attacks.

Hellions: Great in Baron lists. Once again I'll get this out of the way so you know where I'm coming from: I see no use for these outside of a Baron list. Yes, they bring a lot of anti-infantry shots. So do your Venoms and Warriors. Yes, they can tear things apart in close combat. So can your Incubi and your Beasts (which happen to be in the same FOC). Their downfall is the fact that they compete with three amazing units in their own right. However, when they become troops, it's a completely different story. Now you have jump infantry troops that shoot at 18" and can tear apart basic squads in assault. You have one super unit that has Stealth and loves terrain, so all objectives can be threatened. You lost anti-tank in your troop slots, but you have great options in every other FOC.

Scourges: Great in foot lists (no WWP), great in Deepstrike lists, good in most other lists. These guys get Special weapons for cheaper than Reavers when you consider they need one less model. However, the heat lance is not what they want because they lack the speed and assault move of the Reavers. Haywire Blasters are the best suppression fire in the game, and a 5 man squad is very point effective when you consider what they can do to Dreads, Monoliths, and BT Landraiders. You can also give them Dark Lances and have them sit back and shoot. They can move for positioning every so often, and when necessary still give a few poison shots. Think of them as a combination of a Venom and a Raider in that setup. Although I'm more in favor of Haywire Blasters for them, and your list would better benefit from the melta. You could put a single squad in if you are worried about the above units.

[GrenAcid]

@somerandomdude

Great round up. Personaly for scourges I wanna take 2 splinter cannons(cuz I loved when they had 4 in 3ed) and go jump&mow some squads.

[newtoncain]

Neither, run a pack of beasts.
5 Masters
2-4 razorflocks for rending
15 Khymera for 4+ invul
1 Clawed Fiend (maybe)
Start them with a Haemonculus (then he leaves) for FNP.

Around 350-360 with Heamouc.

GW makes pently of beast type models you can use from WH-40K-LotR gaming lines.

[geisthammer]

Time to buy those FW winged rippers to model me some beasts.
Thanks guys.

will scourges be released soon???