"Missing" Legions - Heresy Spoilers

[cwsanger]

I am currently reading "The First Heretic" (yes I know that I am a little behind) and I saw where it mentions the 2 missing legions 2 and 11. Now it gave different reasons for each of these chapters as to why they are missing. It also mentions that shortly after the actions taken against these 2 legions the Ultramarines legion increased in size.

Now outside the Heresy series I have not read much 40K, but to me this seems like the most that we know of these 2 legions. Am I correct in this or where else can I go to find out more about these legions?

Thanks.

[jorz192]

It's a pretty easy question to answer.

You read Thousand Sons, Prospero Burns, Nemesis, and the Dark King and Lightning Tower audio books.

I don't know maybe you have already read or listened to some of the titles.

[Da'Ma55]

For years there was literally zero information as to who the primarchs were or what happened to their legions.

Originally the excuse was GW had two blanks so people had room to invent their own primarchs/chapters/stories.

[wittdooley]

It certainly seems like one of them, based on Prospero Burns, was executed by the VI Legion.

[Vaddok Sek]

It certainly seems like one of them, based on Prospero Burns, was executed by the VI Legion.

True, they are the executioners after all, in Lightning Tower Dorn ponders the two empty plynths in an garden where there are statues of the primarchs and wonders if thier "sepparate tragedies had been to serve as a warning". Whatever happened to them the books Mechanicum and First Heretic say that those who do know swore oaths never to speak of it.

[gwensdad]

My .02 theory (probably less with current exchange rates)

Legions 2 and 11 left Terra on the crusade (as did the other legions) and eventually found their primarchs. For reasons unknown those 2 primarchs "denied" The Emperor and stood against him. A small part of their legions stood with their primarch and they and the Primarch were punished by the 6th legion while the Astartes that were part of those legions but stayed loyal were "found a new home" (i.e. The Ultramarines) and records of legions 2 and 11 destroyed.

This is different from what happens later with Horus in that by the time of The Heresy, legions were 99.9% loyal to whatever the will of their primarch was, while during the search the Astartes from Terra were loyal only to The Emperor.

Well anyway, that was my theory-YMMV.

[Vaddok Sek]

Just curiou,s but if the Ultramarines took in the remains of one of the fallen legions then one has to the wonder how many brothers of the of the present Ultramarines and Ultramarine successor chapters there are who don't actually carry Guilliman's gene seed.

[Fantomex]

Hmm, I'd wager that the two missing primarchs weren't instantly opposed to the Emperor.

If we think about it, the other primarchs all choose not to speak of it, be it an order or too uncomfortable to talk about.

I'd have assumed one of them fell prey to Chaos, but rather than the insidious brainwashing thing Lorgar was subject to, I'd reckon something more like Fulgrims possession, only a lot faster rather than over a length of time being whittled away at.

Wasn't there a certain name given for each of the missing primarchs in The First Heretic?
Something like The Tragic and The Fallen, or another equally teasing nom de plume?

[Lane]

I tend to believe the explanation proposed many years ago on the 40h mailing list.


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By: howard liu

While writing up a lab (Restriction Endonucleases, this time) and plowing through old 40K Digests (I'm picking out good stuff to stick in a web page, one of these days; 260 digests down, about 190 more to go) I thought up a concept for one of the "Lost Chapters." This goes with the idea that they're somehow so disgusting, so horrifying, and so abominable - the rebels of the Horus Heresy have nothing on them - that oblivion would be the only merciful fate. Mind you, it won't make sense if you don't watch "The Simpsons."

So with no further ado...

-begin transmission

Report coded: M322307.15

83-517:Aries Prime-Skye94/Kzer-Za



Report received: M321056.04

95.4915-Taneloth37-Maign/Devlan



To: Imperial Intelligence

From: Senior Observor-Investigator Kalriss

Subject: The Emperor's Samaritans



Legion II of the Adeptus Astartes:

The Emperor's Samaritans



Primarch: Neddus Flanderius

Colors: Green and Pink



The Emperor's Samaritans is a textbook Legion, and is almost completely orthodox. In fact, it is nigh impossible to find any fault with any of them. They are unwavering in their devotion to the Emperor, and fight with unmatchable skill on the field. They have never lost a battle, and events always seem to happen to their advantage. Nonetheless, fewer and fewer Marine Legions are willing to fight alongside the Samaritans, though this does not seem to dismay them or their Primarch. In recent years, Space Wolf Primarch Leman Russ has been reprimanded several times for speaking with Neddus in near-hostile tones ("Shut up, Flanderius."), but several other Primarchs have privately confessed to wanting very badly to do the same. If Neddus has taken any offense to this treatment, he hides it well.



Transcript from an intercepted communication:

<intercepted transmission begins>

"Hi-diddly-odilly, Brother-Sergeant Amael!"

<static> "...idilly-adilly, Brother-Captain Littonius!"

"Brother-Sergeant Amael, <indecipherable> please send a report my way?."

"Oh-diddily-okilly, Brother-Captain Littonius."

"Super-idilly-icious, Brother-Sergeant Amael."

<garbled> "...At 0500 hours, Squads Be'lal and Mattias met and engaged our almost downright inhospitable heretic neighbor buddies."

"Whoa Nellie, my good Brother-Sergeant! I certainly hope you didn't run into any problemeenies!"

"No-sirree-Bob! No survivors on the heretics' side, and no casualties on ours... <static>...a-okay! Report ends, Capta-reeno."

"Fan-ta-tidilly-tastic, Brother-Sergeant Amael. <garbled>...to go! Remember, the Emperor loves us!"

"And we love him, too! Thanks a million! Over-andidilly-out."

<intercepted transmission ends>



Prognosis of the Situation:

The Emperor's Samaritans are causing severe morale problems within the Adeptus Astartes. Three Legions have threatened to defect to the side of the thrice-accursed Rebels if the Samaritans are not turned away. Clearly, decisive action must be taken if this damnable rebellion is to be put to rest cleanly and quickly. Something must be done about the Samaritans, and now.



Recommendations Regarding the Emperor's Samaritans:

If I may speak openly, my honored peers...

Virus-bombing is too good for them.



-end transmission



(editor's notes/epilog:

During the Horus Heresy, the Samaritans were involved in many of the initial conflicts. Every time, a Loyalist Chapter would be in dire straits, and the Samaritans would show up to relieve them, and through a combination of good fortune for the Samaritans and bad luck for the Rebels, the day would instantly be won, with the Samaritans coming out smelling like roses every time. Some superstitious heretics noted that the universe just seemed to like the Samaritans. This, combined with the aggravating speech patterns of the chapter, led the Loyalist forces to offer the Samaritans over to Horus' forces. As it turned out, none of Horus' Marines were willing to stand alongside the Samaritans, either, and the deal fell through.

However, on Yarrant III, the entirety of the Emperor's Samaritans Chapter was caught in the middle of a large conflict, supported by elements of the Space Wolves Marine Legion, and facing a larger combined force of Traitor Night Lords and Wordbearers. When the Samaritans appeared on the scene, a run of bad luck immediately began to plague the Rebel forces. This was reversed, however, when all the Space Wolves, as one, turned on the Emperor's Samaritans and attacked them from the rear. Joined by the Night Lords and Wordbearers, the Space Wolves slaughtered the Emperor's Samaritans to a man, leaving no survivors, not even (especially, actually) their Primarch. Naturally, the Night Lords and Wordbearers immediately attacked and destroyed the Space Wolves, and posthumous honors were subsequently piled upon the Space Wolves.

No now-living Imperial knows the true fate of the Emperor's Samaritans, and the Chaos Marines aren't talking. Immediately following the genocide, the other Legions noticed the Samaritans' disappearance, but chose to ask no questions. When asked about the missing Chapter, the Space Wolves consistently replied, in unison, "I don't know, they were here just a minute ago; I think the Blood Angels saw them last," whereas the Blood Angels pointed their fingers at the Imperial Fists, who looked to the Whitescars, and so on. In time, even this pretense ended, and the Marines would simply shrug and look confused. Hundreds of years later, the truth of the matter was well and truly lost to time, and there was no longer any way to determine the true nature of the second Chapter of the Adeptus Astartes. When the Inquisition came into its full power, unearthing the truth behind this "Lost Chapter" seemed to be a thankless job, when all the money was in squelching open heresy and in daemon-hunting, so the decision was made to delete all remaining records and declare the missing chapter an "official mystery.")

[Bigred]

The bigger issue I have with the whole thing is they seem to have written themselves into a corner here.

Why on terra would any of the traitor Primarchs (several of which are now immortal daemon-princes) give a flying fig about thier oaths of silence on the matter to their father. They had already gone traitor.

The only thing that makes any sense is a deep sense of shame, as if the fate of thier two brothers somehow had all thier collective brothers blood on thier hands.