In Relation to REAL Armies...

[Beta_Ray_Bill]

I've heard of the most obvious. The Black templars referred to as the acient crusaders, or the first riech,( However you want to say it) and the Eldar as the Holy Roman Empire, or the Tau as the Turks...

But how does the BOLS community feel about the possible relations to early history army relations to their respective army choices? Does anyone with historical knowledge feel any relations? Just curious!

[Denzark]

I'll give you Black Templars as crusaders, it is quite obvious. I have never heard of the other comparisons you mention, neither would I agree with them.

I give you IG WWII Russians (massed wave infantry, tanks, arty).


Other than that it is all subjective and rather obvious a la SW/vikings.

[eldargal]

I'm fairly well versed in Holy Roman Imperial history and I honestly don't see any kind of similarities with the Eldar. In fact I think its far too difficult to find real world analogies for 40k. You can just about manage it with WFB (Empire=HRE, Bretonnia=Frogcais, High Elves= Britain, Lizardmen=Mesoamerica, Dwarfs=Mythic Scandinavia, etcetera) but the aesthetics and cultures have been altered too much in 40k. You can manage it with some of the IG though. Cadians=modern militaries, Praetorians=Victorian Britain, Vostroyans=Russians, DKOK=WWII Germans, Valhallans=MidEast etcetera

[Beta_Ray_Bill]

I'm fairly well versed in Holy Roman Imperial history and I honestly don't see any kind of similarities with the Eldar. In fact I think its far too difficult to find real world analogies for 40k. You can just about manage it with WFB (Empire=HRE, Bretonnia=Frogcais, High Elves= Britain, Lizardmen=Mesoamerica, Dwarfs=Mythic Scandinavia, etcetera) but the aesthetics and cultures have been altered too much in 40k. You can manage it with some of the IG though. Cadians=modern militaries, Praetorians=Victorian Britain, Vostroyans=Russians, DKOK=WWII Germans, Valhallans=MidEast etcetera

You, miss, have embodied and dismissed the similarities within each army I've thought of. The Holy Roman Empire, Once expanding bodies of land and continually (through catholicism) dominating land masses has a great hold on the world/40k universe has waned in recent years. There was in both universes, a great fall; into which both 'armies' have both taken a back seat to being the forerunner by far. Diversity has sprung forth in so many ways that both the HRE and the Eldar are now Dwarfed from what they used to be.

[eldargal]

The problem is the HRE was never an 'empire' in the same sense the Eldar were, and the HRE was a feudal government before the fall and ceased to be feudal after whereas the Eldar became feudal after the fall. The fall of the HRE was brought about by foreign invasion that of the Eldar by internal rot. Hm now I've written it that way I see more of a parallel between Eldar and Rome.

Oh and a friend of mine says the Tau Empire is analogous to the Swiss Confederation, and I think he is right. Too smll but too powerful to be worth crushing. Orks are analogous to Glasgow...

[Beta_Ray_Bill]

Point! However, I was curious about similarities, as opposed to dissimilarities from the armies! As I've just brought up in your post in the oubilette, your attentiveness to the lack of details. I've heard only a few arguments to what these individual people think of their armies, while I am trying to understand outside thoughts! I do understand your arguments, but I think that they do somewhat distract from the topic.

[Morgan Darkstar]

Orks are analogous to Glasgow...

You should see the mess they make when they come down to Newcastle for the night life!

[eldargal]

Ah but that is the problem for me, there are always going to be some similarities, any Empire that has fallen is going to have similarities with the Eldar, for example. You could argue England in the middle ages is analogous with the Tau, a small country fighting off much bigger, wealthier competitors and so forth. As I said with WFB there are clear historical archetypes, with 40k its just a mishmash of whatever seemed cool at the time. Based on a few similarities you could argue that the Eldar are based on Rome, Athens, Britain, Sparta etcetera.

Point! However, I was curious about similarities, as opposed to dissimilarities from the armies! As I've just brought up in your post in the oubilette, your attentiveness to the lack of details. I've heard only a few arguments to what these individual people think of their armies, while I am trying to understand outside thoughts! I do understand your arguments, but I think that they do somewhat distract from the topic.

[Astral Platypus]

It's hard for me not to think of Celts or Gauls when I think Eldar. I know a lot of that is covered by Space Wolves and other Chapters, but still...

You say Yriel Iyanden, and all I can think of is Vercingetorix or a male analogue of Boudica.

[Scion_of_Terra]

While the power structure of the 40k universe is rather unique, the cultural templates are obviously copypasta. The IG are all 20th century nations, while the SM are classical and medieval factions. The Eldar represent the old Orient, while the Tau are a more modern-day Asia (which makes sense that they'd be related like that, if you read the fluff), what with their castes, communism, and love of mecha. Crons are ancient Egypt, and the Orks are simply monkeys with AKs and grenades.