Citadel Fine Cast

[Lancel]

Me too, I have my unprimed metal winged autarch right in front of me and the difference is significant.

Hey, maybe if you could, you could do up a comparison pic. I'm sure someone will be doing this eventually, but it might help us see the difference.

[harrybuttwhisker]

The crispness of the cast is due to the mechanical properties of resin, any miniature transferred from metal to resin would show a similar increase in crispness.

There is no extra detail the new moulds are created from the original masters used for the metal miniatures.

GW has bought in industry standard equipment to replace ageing soon to be replaced metal casting equipment. There is no R & D cost or huge investment in new tooling, merely a days training for the casting guys.

They brought in resin to replace metal as it is 60-90% cheaper depending on volume to cast in resin, it removes the Market instability of metal prices from there annual costings forecast and because it is lighter it reduces shipping costs.

GW where not the first to start the change from metal to resin in wargaming circles, the big name that did this was privateer press. Privateer press recognised the savings and were able to pass on a price decrease as well as increasing there profit margins.

GW has instead increased the prices on these miniatures by a measure way over inflation.

This is nothing but flagrant profiteering an are trying to use untruthful biased reporting of the change over through media channels it controls (there website, there facebook page, White dwarf and store employs) to hide the truth from there customers.

GW no longer respects it's customers enough to tell them the truth and even worse goes out of there way to hide it.

[wittdooley]

The crispness of the cast is due to the mechanical properties of resin, any miniature transferred from metal to resin would show a similar increase in crispness.

There is no extra detail the new moulds are created from the original masters used for the metal miniatures.

GW has bought in industry standard equipment to replace ageing soon to be replaced metal casting equipment. There is no R & D cost or huge investment in new tooling, merely a days training for the casting guys.

They brought in resin to replace metal as it is 60-90% cheaper depending on volume to cast in resin, it removes the Market instability of metal prices from there annual costings forecast and because it is lighter it reduces shipping costs.

GW where not the first to start the change from metal to resin in wargaming circles, the big name that did this was privateer press. Privateer press recognised the savings and were able to pass on a price decrease as well as increasing there profit margins.

GW has instead increased the prices on these miniatures by a measure way over inflation.

This is nothing but flagrant profiteering an are trying to use untruthful biased reporting of the change over through media channels it controls (there website, there facebook page, White dwarf and store employs) to hide the truth from there customers.

GW no longer respects it's customers enough to tell them the truth and even worse goes out of there way to hide it.

Dude, Privateer didn't reduce the cost of any of their plastic troops. They still cost the exact same as their metal counterparts.

[BrokenWing]

You know for years the elitist attitude in gaming in this area was Warhammer Fantasy players, but now it's the local Warmachine players who try to convince you how stupid you are for not playing Warmachine (I'm sorry, I don't find warmachine appealing at all)and apparently that has carried over to the internet as well. Our local store carries both products and I keep an eye on Warmachine models and pricing, and I have no idea where he's getting this "lower prices" line. When GW starts charging $85 for a metal horse drawn wagon, let me know.

[harrybuttwhisker]

Between buying a khador starter box in metal for myself, then a plastic/resin one for a commission shortly after the change it had dropped by just over a fiver in price. Both were bought from the same retailer a couple of months apart and it was the same for all the starter boxes.

[BrokenWing]

All the starter boxes here are the same price they've always been. I will say they have nicely priced starter boxes (but so does GW these days. They cost more, but you also get more) but after that I don't see much of a price difference.

[harrybuttwhisker]

I can only speak for the price changes I experienced over here. The gun carriage BTW is the equivalent of a bane blade which is what $95 these days.

Personally I'm a huge fan of the GW game systems, I like the models and I like the setting. The prices themselves alone are no real issue you for me, I'm financially comfortable.

The bugbear I have is that they couldn't be honest with there customer base or at least be good liars, they have put out a very thin tissue of misinformation and far too many holes are getting poked into it.

As it stands GW won't even give an official conformation of wether the material is safe to sand and saw. They have only put out a vague statement saying the miniatures themselves are "safe" and have been tested by an as yet unnamed third party.

Every year in the past GW increased there prices ( in fact usually more than once a year ) and we took it on the chin because we liked the game and the miniatures, but they didn't lie to us or try to enforce a dubious restraint of international trade.

There was wriggle room for a price freeze on metals transferred to resin and room to improve the exchange rate for both canadiens and Australians before the embargo. Small token gestures would shown at least some thought for there customer base and would most likely have headed this all off at the pass.

However GW where too greedy (I will accept too stupid as a possibility) to respect customers enough to make even a token gesture. Respect is a two way respect and GW have lost what respect I had for them.

[wittdooley]

The metal PP starter boxes used to be $39.99. The Plastic Starter boxes are $49.99.

Further, the big PP kits aren't even near the size of a Baneblade. The Gun Carriage isn't even bigger than a Land Raider. At least the Baneblade isn't meant to be used in "regular" games; the Gun Carriage, etc, are. Kinda screws people on a budget, much like competetive M:tG.

I guess I don't get what 'misinformation' you're driving at. Even ForgeWorld Resin is safe to sand and saw. It isn't a carginogenic resin; simply, any small particle you're producing can be a throat, nose, or eye irritant. It's the same reason you wear a mask/glasses when sanding wood.

[BrokenWing]

A baneblade is also twice the size.

Price increases don't bother me much for reasons I have explained in other threads in some detail.

I'm not sure why you're surprised by the lack of information so far. GW always releases big news very slowly, it gets people more interested in it and makes sure they can hype it up more. They're *still* telling us about Storm of Magic.

I wouldn't worry about it being safe, common sense dictates the resin will be safe, considering the average age of their customer base and that Forge World resin is confirmed safe by Forge World. If Forge World can do it I have no idea why GW wouldn't be able to.

I take some of what they say about improved detail with a grain of salt. Will we see giant massive superdoom improvements on current models? Not likely. Will we see giant massive superdoom improvement down the road? I would argue yes. One look at the first model made with Finecast in mind and not just copied over from metal (the haemonculus) will show dramatic improvement, at least it does in my mind. That's where the hype about improved model quality is going.

GW isn't lying, they're doing what companies always do, overselling their product.

[Lane]

Every year in the past GW increased there prices ( in fact usually more than once a year ) and we took it on the chin because we liked the game and the miniatures, but they didn't lie to us or try to enforce a dubious restraint of international trade.

They stated that changes in currency values allowed online retailers to unfairly take advantage of AU customers. Half True, the stronger AU $ made buying at UK prices a better deal. It also means that GW makes even more off the AU customers. Assuming that AU retailers pay half MSRP which is twice the UK price then GW makes twice as much profit off them. GW store in AU make even more profit since the GW get's the full MSRP.