Chaos is...back?

[BrokenWing]

Edited: Didn't see your last response.


You did say I had no idea what I was doing and clearly implied I was an idiot in the process. If you think I didn't listen to your anti-tank suggestion, look at the last list I posted.

[Bean]

I posted this:

Any half-way decent mech eldar or mech guard list would ruin this--it has virtually no long ranged anti-tank. Lascannons on the Raider (which it can't use without slowing down your 500 point uber-close combat unit) and two battlecannons? If it gets lucky against Guard and gets abbadon in, he'll do some damage, but ruining this with Mech Eldar would be child's play--Abbadon would do nothing, and the rest of the army would basically be in the same boat.

I mean, sure--it's going to ruin half-assed mech marines shooting missiles out of rhinos, but that's just not a difficult feat.

Needs more guns. Specifically, more Obliterators. Otherwise, its just a rock--and will lose to its paper pretty much every time.

In response, you posted this:

See, you just basically defined the Chaos codex.

This is sufficient to demonstrate that you don't know what you're talking about. I explained why that is the case. I didn't call you an idiot. I didn't imply that you were an idiot. I said that you don't know what you're talking about, then I explained why. If you imagined I said more than I did, that's your fault--not mine.


Also, that last list is an improvement, but not nearly enough of one. Possessed, tri-las predator is, unfortunately, not worth it. I've played it a bunch, out of necessity, and it rarely fails to disappoint.

At 2000 points, you need more. It doesn't necessarily have to be lascannons. Meltas are acceptable and easy to come by in the Chaos list. Again, dropping those noise marines for something good would solve the problem easily.

[BrokenWing]

After this weekend, I tend to agree that Noise Marines are much less useful than I want them to be, just not nearly as many infantry anymore as there used to be. I could probably do something a bit similar to my Space Wolf list that did pretty well at the GT but with Plague Marines.

I did consider (and am still considering) 5 man Chosen squads with 5 melta guns for infiltrating tank hunting, but I'm not really sure I'm sold on the idea. Things could go badly for them real fast if I didn't get first turn.

[Bean]

After this weekend, I tend to agree that Noise Marines are much less useful than I want them to be, just not nearly as many infantry anymore as there used to be. I could probably do something a bit similar to my Space Wolf list that did pretty well at the GT but with Plague Marines.

I did consider (and am still considering) 5 man Chosen squads with 5 melta guns for infiltrating tank hunting, but I'm not really sure I'm sold on the idea. Things could go badly for them real fast if I didn't get first turn.

Yeah, it seems tempting to use the Infiltrate on those Chosen, but, usually, it's just better to put them in a Rhino. Sometimes, you'll want to outflank them in their Rhino, but usually they'll end up being better as just a CSM squad with more meltas. If you're not filling out your Heavy Support slots, you can use quad-melta Havocs, too, to avoid paying for Infiltrate.

Going to Plague Marines would be a good call. Plasma is fine, but I'd try to give at least one squad melta guns.

[Denzark]

Respectfully, you're not playing to your strengths. Don't leap to Bean's tune. What the hell - Mech Eldar? As if this is anywhere near the magnitude of Mech Guard as a threat.

You are not playing to your strengths, as discussed previously. Noise Marines firing 7 sonic blasters are not as effective as getting in at least 20 I5 attacks - 30 if the squad charges. The power weapon will pair out a squad. Do the mathhammer!

Oblits are so easily countered nowadays, they'll die if they teleport close after one round of shooting, and can't melta at range - 3 lascannons might as well be a guard squad.

If you get first turn and throw everything right forward you may get 1st turn charges, lock the shooters and win. Use cover, use smoke. Defiler - a 66% chance of at least 9 " on first turn and 50% chance of surviving any attack no matter how strong. If you get second try reserving depending on table edges and terrain, or hide in cover or behind the raider!

This is a thin list but not impossible if you play to strengths.

[Bean]

Respectfully, you're not playing to your strengths. Don't leap to Bean's tune. What the hell - Mech Eldar? As if this is anywhere near the magnitude of Mech Guard as a threat.

You are not playing to your strengths, as discussed previously. Noise Marines firing 7 sonic blasters are not as effective as getting in at least 20 I5 attacks - 30 if the squad charges. The power weapon will pair out a squad. Do the mathhammer!

Oblits are so easily countered nowadays, they'll die if they teleport close after one round of shooting, and can't melta at range - 3 lascannons might as well be a guard squad.

If you get first turn and throw everything right forward you may get 1st turn charges, lock the shooters and win. Use cover, use smoke. Defiler - a 66% chance of at least 9 " on first turn and 50% chance of surviving any attack no matter how strong. If you get second try reserving depending on table edges and terrain, or hide in cover or behind the raider!

This is a thin list but not impossible if you play to strengths.

If you manage to get a first turn charge with this list, it means you're playing against an incompetent. No-one cares whether their lists can beat people who practically beat themselves.

Anyway, the list is garbage against Mech Guard, too.

[BrokenWing]

Wouldn't worry about me leaping to anyone's tune, I'm still mulling over alot of directions with this list and will probably post yet another version later in the day. There is much to consider, and much I wish to keep in mind after my good experiences at the Grand Tournament. If I can bring in what worked from my Space Wolves into the Chaos but in a good, Chaosy fashion, then I very well may do that. My space wolves had no anti-tank beyond 24 inches, but did pretty well and really only suffer against Tanks once, when I kept rolling ones to shake on penetrating hits against a pair of Land Raiders.

[BrokenWing]

HQ


Grand Praetor Romulus (Abaddon)- 275

Elites

4 Praetorian Guard (Terminators) with lightning claws, mark of slaanesh- 175

-Dedicated Pre-Heresy Land Raider with Daemonic Possession- 240

Troops:

10 Plague Marines, Champion, Power Fist, Two Melta Guns-290
-Dedicated Rhino-35

10 Plague Marines, Champion, Power Fist, Two Melta Guns-290
-Dedicated Rhino-35

10 Plague Marines, Two Melta Guns-250
-Dedicated Rhino-35

Heavy Support:

3 Obliterators- 225

Defiler, 2 extra ccw- 150

-2000

[Bean]

HQ


Grand Praetor Romulus (Abaddon)- 275

Elites

4 Praetorian Guard (Terminators) with lightning claws, mark of slaanesh- 175

-Dedicated Pre-Heresy Land Raider with Daemonic Possession- 240

Troops:

10 Plague Marines, Champion, Power Fist, Two Melta Guns-290
-Dedicated Rhino-35

10 Plague Marines, Champion, Power Fist, Two Melta Guns-290
-Dedicated Rhino-35

10 Plague Marines, Two Melta Guns-250
-Dedicated Rhino-35

Heavy Support:

3 Obliterators- 225

Defiler, 2 extra ccw- 150

-2000

I like that list better.

[BrokenWing]

The lack of extra armor makes me really nervous, but it gave me the points to put in the Defiler, which I think is worth doing.