Sister announce in WD

[Lancel]

Agreed. It just happens to make up for a lot of things that gimp the Sisters. Of course it would be nice if we didn't have to use it to make up for stuff, or if there were other nice options too, or if the points were better balanced and we didn't have to pay 15 points for a Meltagun on some squads, but yeah, there you go. Would it be overpowered in another army list? Hell yeah, but the Witchhunters list just isn't very strong on its own.

And really I completely agree with your analogy to ATSKNF. If you took the same WH list and just took out the BoSL, it would be like taking a Space Marine list and taking out ATSKNF. The book is just that important. It is a piece of wargear, and maybe wargear should simply add useful options, but that's just not how it turned out. Certainly if someone took the WH list and removed only the book, the WH army would be much weaker, about as if someone took ATSKNF from the Space Marines and effectively make the army even less competitive than it already is. I mean it's not like the Book is making unstoppable cheese build Sisters armies here. We use the book and it just happens to help us actually win once in a while. It's not like they're Long Fangs.

[flekkzo]

Not to mention Marines have bolt pistols to assist their assaulting, and Sisters have to BUY their leadership rules (through the VSS for Faith and the BoSL for morale) where Marines get ATSKNF and Combat Tactics built in. Ten sisters with VSS, frags, kraks, and BoSL are about 16 points per model. Even if you consider BoSL+Faith to be a good trade-off for ATSKNF and Combat Tactics, marines still get +1 Weapon Skill, +1 Strength, +1 Toughness, + Initiative and Bolt Pistols for a mere one point more.

And all the while Sisters have fewer options to play with for support, so their troops HAVE to pick up the slack, but aren't able to. It's not so bad for IG vets to be seemingly a bit pricey when you have so many excellent vehicles supporting them, for example-- you don't see IG vet armies doing badly... because even if IG vets themselves aren't that exceptional (which is debatable, given three special weapons), they have the best vehicles in the game to support them. Sisters have... well, nothing but Exorcists, which for how much they're used still aren't as powerful as many people think they are. Mostly they're just used because Sisters have nothing else that fulfills that important role.

Compare it to a Grey Hunter or Long Fang and those Vanilla Marines don't look quite as tasty anymore. Sisters should come stock with the good stuff and have plenty of useful upgrades. All for a low point cost.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

As long as they bring out new models that look cool and have attractive faces and sexy bodies, I'm buying. I know how that sounds girls, but I wouldn't want to buy them if they were ugly. Scars are ok, and they don't have to have great big boobs, but I like the bob cut and the good-looking Sisters thing. And I like an army that's a bit sexy. That's not all though - I really like the juxtaposition of their creed against their look - purity and faith, the most devout of armies, the Ecclesiastic feel to them, the Saints and Martyrs - you might lay hands on them, but it's the last thing those hands would feel. I don't think they should be entirely sexualised and turned into a lesbian fantasy range or anything like that, I just hope they leave that little bit of sexiness in there for us sad old married types

[Lockark]

I would rather keep C:WH than get a ****ty non-codex codex which adds nothing and removes plenty. Especially since we probably won't get any plastic until the REAL codex comes out anyway.

Hell **** that, I'd sooner just use my own fandex, which at least TRIES to keep sisters up with fifth edition than this crap.

It may just be me, but all we have is a handful of rumors that only give us a vague idea how the book works. I would suggest waiting until the final book before getting the pitch forks out at least....

I personally am not convinced from the current rumors that thier has been anything changed that would cripple the army.

[Melissia]

The army's already effectively crippled in C:WH. Sure it can hold a gun, but it can't dance and it has no momentum for throwing punches, nor can it drive any tanks.

[andrewm9]

It may just be me, but all we have is a handful of rumors that only give us a vague idea how the book works. I would suggest waiting until the final book before getting the pitch forks out at least....

I personally am not convinced from the current rumors that thier has been anything changed that would cripple the army.

The rumors indicate that next to no units have been added to the army and instead the opposite is true. Having lost all teh Inqusition elements like Inquisitors and Assassins alonh with the Inquisitorial stormtroopers is a blow. The choices ofr the codex have slimmed down even more. Sisters and the Ecclesiarchy elements currently make up 1 Special Character and 13 units not counting the transport including the Palatine, the Immolator, and the Priest. The Palatine really is a bad idea considerign the boost of the Canoness over her at 10 more points, the Immolator is really just a transport not a real Heavy Support, and the Priest can't be used as your real HQ and in fact is really just a unit upgrade.

Most 5th edition codexes have 20+ units without transports and 6+ special characters. Most have several possible army builds with a few competitive ones. Combine that with the appearance of lack of strong faith options and its no wonder that people are concerned. It woudl also seem that with no new models this 'test bed' is going to fail since the success of a codex is measured by model sales. No new models or price decreases means no real sales usually

I don't want to say the sky is falling and I really want to believe this is going to be a good codex but it doesn't look good based on what we know. I will reserve final judgement until i see the new rules and costs. Hopefully its well edited and teh Rhinos actually have fire points and exit points. In short it looks liek they are only taking away and "modernizing" the codex and not really adding anything. How would a Space Marine player feel if the codexes were rewritten and they lost half the codex and gained nothing.

[CouchViking]

, I just hope they leave that little bit of sexiness in there for us sad old married types

Hahaha...... I wish I didn't know how you felt though.

[Lockark]

The rumors indicate that next to no units have been added to the army and instead the opposite is true. Having lost all teh Inqusition elements like Inquisitors and Assassins alonh with the Inquisitorial stormtroopers is a blow.

Hold it.

I'm sorry but Confessors are new but are also bassicly Inquisitors by another name, and basically have all the options for henchmen that GK inquisitors have.

The rumors said Assassins were gone, but I never read anything that said the storm troopers were gone. For all we know they could be staying or getting a replacement like inquisitors.

Also for all we know Franis Militia could be reintroduced, since they could be a troop choice that would be easy to convert using some of the current plastic kits. Their is still allot their that they could do, since GW has shown it's cool with having entries with no models.

The trick will be what they can come up with, that will fit the army and be able to be easily converted.

Most 5th edition codexes have 20+ units without transports and 6+ special characters. Most have several possible army builds with a few competitive ones. Combine that with the appearance of lack of strong faith options and its no wonder that people are concerned. It woudl also seem that with no new models this 'test bed' is going to fail since the success of a codex is measured by model sales. No new models or price decreases means no real sales usually

I'm still not convinced the removal of the old faith system will cripple the book. I remember when the new Imperial Guard book came out and guard players were flipping their **** that doctrinaires were being removed and that it was going to cripple the army.

(Heck. Same when ever any gimmicky army mechanic is removed from a book.)

A new mechanic also coming with new point coasts that will help balance it all out.

I don't want to say the sky is falling and I really want to believe this is going to be a good codex but it doesn't look good based on what we know. I will reserve final judgement until i see the new rules and costs. Hopefully its well edited and teh Rhinos actually have fire points and exit points.

I don't think this is going to be a amazing codex, but I dough this codex is going to be terrible. I think it's going to be "good" in that it will re-point the army for 5th, and bring it up to speed with the current design philosophies.

[Lancel]

There was a post on Dakka from the Cities of Death strategems in this month's White Dwarf. Note that it explicitly mentions to look at the next issue for more details.

It discusses their strategem being related to buildings and a consecrated shrine which gives them extra faith. Any Sister unit inside a consecrated shrine counts as having a Simulacrum Imperialis and if they pass their faith test, you can roll a D6 and on a 5 or 6 your army gains a Faith Point.

It also explicitly mentions to see the next issue for more details on this.

Works within what we know, but only one faith point amidst the many seems somewhat weak? Maybe that's the intention. Biggest note I think is that the Simulacrum Imperialis is confirmed to still be in in some shape or form.

I think it also confirms that the faith pool is army wide.

[DarkLink]

Having lost all teh Inqusition elements like Inquisitors and Assassins alonh with the Inquisitorial stormtroopers is a blow.

Well, the old Inquisitor units sucked anyways. So do most of the new ones, too, but at least there's a few competitive Inquisitor units. And since the rumors claim that they'll have a set of units very similar to the GK henchmen squads, I wouldn't complain until we know more.