On Imotekh and Destroyers

[Necron2.0]

Ok, so ... just got my copy of the Necron Codex. I haven't finished my analysis of it and I likewise haven't decided if I'm going to shelve my Necrons because of it, however ....

The first thing I'm noticing is that Destroyers are the road to failure. I've never actually fielded Destroyers, because they take up a fast attack slot, and given how badly Necrons have always blown in close combat, I've found unless I'm fielding at least one unit of scarabs (two are preferred), I can bank on losing my entire army in sweeping advances. In the old rules, at least "we'll be back" mitigated this to some degree, but the new rules make it worse, since all downed Necrons self-destruct if their unit falls back. I used to field heavy destroyers (usually one unit as fire support with two monoliths), back when heavy destroyers were classed as heavy support. Now, they are simply a Destroyer upgrade. So, looks like all my destroyers get shelved at the very least.

The other thing I noticed, and was wondering if others have noted (I hadn't seen this posted yet, so apologies if I just missed it), is the implications of Imotekh's Staff of the Destroyer on close combat. The staff is basically a template weapon - pick a direction, fire and it hits whatever is under it. Unlike a normal template weapon, however, you don't have to actually fire it at anything. This means he could willfully fire it in the direction of, say, a squad of marines surrounded by scarabs. This stands a good chance of annihilating the marines, leaving most of the scarabs able to lock something else up next turn. Of course, this is a one-shot deal, but still ....

[Brymm]

Doesn't "shelving your Necrons" seem to be a little bit of an over reaction? Scarabs are great. I don't think it's a big deal that in order to compete on a higher level you need to use them. If you want to compete as Space Wolves, you probably need to use Long Fangs. If you want to compete as Grey Knights, you probably need Psyflemen. If you want to compete as Marines, you need Rhinos and if you want to compete as Guard you need Chimeras.
From what I've found and from what the internet says (which, as we know, is never wrong :-p), in order to compete, you need to use Scarabs. Does that mean 30? No. There can still be room for your destroyers.

[Demonus]

My only complaints with Imotekh are that his staff isnt even a power weapon, just a 1 shot str 6 ap weapon that can go 2-12inches. after that, it is just a piece of rebar he can hit bad guys with.

his 4+ steal initiative is cool...50% of the time, and his nano scarab thing only comes into play if you field deep striking flayed ones...which cant assault if you deep strike with them....

should be under 200pts for his abilities/gear.

[The Twilight Fade]

It's the tactical flexibility that makes him worth his cost. Yeah he sucks in CC (re-rolls to hit and wound but no power weapon but can be used as a flamer!!) but for the cost you get a phaeron overlord (a whole 20 point upgrade on a normal overlord), seize on a 4+ which is huge for some army builds, night fighting for extended periods of time which screws guard parking lots over (plus free lightning strikes on their units) AND he has a 2+/3++ AND carries a resurrection orb AND the staff of the destroyer shot previously mentioned

I don't see how he's not worth the points tbh

[Brymm]

Agreed. I think all of the named ICs are amazing in this codex but am alittle dissapointed that they don't allow FOC swaps like in other armies. It seems like, with the blood scarabs rule, they were maybe THINKING about it (as in allowing flayed ones to be troops). I wish it would have happened.

[White925]

Yeah most of the named characters in the necron codex are pretty good. The stormlord i think is prolly the best because of making night fight for an average of three turns can just destroy certain armies, also the lightning attack ontop of that is just crazy. Id have to say a really cool character orikan not the best but his super saiyan mode is awesome. I like the necron codex very balanced in my opinion with certain builds but it will be very easy to make a bad list with necrons.

[Maelstorm]

Immotek allows me to get the Scarabs into vehicle parking lots with less harassment...

The Destroyers new and improved 24" weapon range makes them expensive bolter fodder for 90% of the armies out there. They need to sell the "new" jetbikes, so the old Jetbikes (Destroyers) had to take a hit. 180 points for 3 single-shot 36" range Lascannons riding on a 1 wound chassis doesn't give me a warm-fuzzy feeling. Adding 80 points to "bulk" the unit up only gives you 2 more 3+ save wounds with miss-matched ranges.

[Brymm]

It appears they are really making the Necron player focus on manuervability and shooting, not so much RANGE and shooting. I wonder if this was intentional?
Seems to be, considering the Storm Lord and Solar Pulse allowing you to cut range from your opponent. Next, consider the seemingly 24" range for guns across the board. Next, consider all of the fast/skimmer/jump pack/teleport every turn/jet bike/beast swarms the codex has. Next, consider that Necrons, save for 1 really expensive unit (big Lychgaurd units with swords and shields) are horrible in close combat. Finally consider that there is no army like this one.

So what was Ward's vision?

An army that uses manuervability and superior short ranged fire power to win.

I can imagine he was thinking of a constantly shifthing battle plan, moving units in to shoot, moving others to cover, teleporting out of range before being assaulted the following turn, manipulating night fighting rules to confuse the shooting and assualt armies alike. Nearly everything in the Codex supports this idea.

Most of the strategies floating out there seem to want to try some "gun line" business or some "walking unkillable relentless machines of death" idea where the silver baddies march forward, take hits and keep on coming. These do not play to the seeming designed strength of the army.

Perhaps more of an army along the lines of immotek/ court/ scarabs/ jet bikes supported by night scythe immortals or night scythe warriors and annihilation barges. Maybe there's a spot in there for Obyron with some Lychguard or something as a counter assualt unit. Use the superior mobility, short range lethal firepower and better generalship and win the day....
but I ramble on.

[thecactusman17]

That sounds right Brymm, and I think that it is a natural evolution from the old army. The traditionally mid-ranged to short ranged army always lacked for the ability to engage with an enemy unless they took a small handful of units. But now, even without the new transports, the army is significantly more mobile at a minor cost in durability. A full static gunline is frankly going to get murdered by several armies. With a single approach vector and the way multiple assaults work now, gunlines have to focus on repelling assault units after 2-3 turns of shooting maximum, and then they collapse, OR they have to mobilize to dictate where and when the enemy can engage them, if at all. So if necrons want to gunline, they have to do it in a particularly mobile way, avoiding the pitfall of just allowing themselves to take shots like they used to.

[Tynskel]

has anyone noticed that Heavy Destroyers are cheaper...