Necrons Vs Daemons - Ideas?

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

So I'll be facing my own Daemons next week with the Necrons available to me - pretty poetic huh? Anyway, here are my thoughts. Please bear in mind that I tend not to proxy models if I can help it, and I don't have access to unlimited Ghost Arks! (I have two, which I may include to up the points total of the game, the Daemons can match it).

Here's my list:

Trazyn the Infinite – 175 points
Necron Warriors x 20, Necron Lord w/Resurrection Orb and Phase Shifter, Cryptek w/Tremorstave – 390 points
Necron Warriors x 20, Necron Lord w/Resurrection Orb and Phase Shifter, Cryptek w/Tremorstave – 390 points
Necron Warriors x 20, Necron Lord w/Resurrection Orb and Phase Shifter, Cryptek w/Tremorstave – 390 points
Immortals x 10 (Tesla), Necron Lord w/Resurrection Orb, Cryptek w/Voltaic Staff and Lightning Field – 270 points
Immortals x 10 (Tesla), Necron Lord w/Resurrection Orb, Cryptek w/Voltaic Staff and Ether Crystal – 275 points
Deathmarks x5 – 95 points
Destroyer Lord w/Sepiternal Weave, Warscythe and Resurrection Orb – 170 points
Triarch Praetorians x 5 with Voidblades and Particle Casters = 200 points
C’Tan Shard – Writhing Worldscape and Time’s Arrow – 260 points
Annihilation Barges x 2 – 180 points
Monolith – 200 points

And here's my thinking: -

Trazyn over the Stormlord, because my opponent will be a sitting duck on the first turn, with little firepower of his own, so I certainly don't want Nightfighting rules buggering it up for me. Trazyn, attached to one of the other units, is a good deterrent for the CC daemons, as large units are likely to take big hits from Trazyn's special ability (provided he can kill one member of the attacking squad.)

The Lords with Res Orbs are a no brainer to me. The longer my Crons keep coming back, the better. And they aren't that shabby in CC in terms of surviving long enough to grind out a win against all but the nastiest of CC attackers. They may as well keep the Staff of Light cos the other free upgrades won't do me any good against invulnerable saves.

The Crypteks with Tremorstaves are useful in trying to bog down opposing units, especially when combined with the C'Tan's Writhing Worldscape. I think the Ether Crystal MAY be useful if the Immortals can sit on an objective, and the Lightning Field is at least a deterrent or even leveller in a CC situation. Voltaic Staffs may come in handy to support fire against Soulgrinders.

Tesla for the Immortals - the Inv saves of Daemons means greater numbers of hits will be more effective than AP obviously, and seeing as Gauss Blasters are same Strength, Tesla every time.

Deathmarks may actually be of use against a first turn deep striking army - I'm thinking Target=Fateweaver (let's face it, he's gonna be turning up!)

The Destroyer Lord and Praetorians are a bit of a gamble really, but they might be useful in carving through Plaguebearers and other Nurgle daemons, as they'll be striking at the same time. Also likely to be useful Vs Soulgrinders. Res Orb may help survivability.

The C'Tan shard has the Worldscape to slow CC specialists down (fear the Bloodletters!), and Time's Arrow is specifically for Daemon Prince and Greater Daemon-hunting duty. He'll skulk behind the monolith until he can pounce.

The Annihilation barges should be able to take out big chunks of his infantry, as his retaliatory firepower will be minimal, so two is going to hurt,

The Monolith is nigh on impenetrable to him as long as my C'Tan can intercept big gribblies - I won't let Screamers within 20" of it! But it is most use ploughing towards objectives until it can dump a unit right on top of it. The Flayer arrays and Particle Whip add additional anti infantry firepower.

SO... that's what I have so far, but looking for additional ideas to consider, tweaks etc etc. Points cap is 3K right now, but we could play to 3.5K

Cheers!

[marandamir]

Mindshackle scarabs..... TAKE THEM! Nuff said.

[Jenn]

First of all, as it is the list is illegal. Unfortunately you cant have two royal courts if you take a destroyer lord, which is the true cost of the model. Secondly, surprisingly enough tremor tactics aren't horribly effective against daemons, at least not in my experience. One of the guys I practice with at my local shop runs a Khorne based list (with plague bearers for good measure) which is the list that would most be affected by tremor/ writhing worldscape in the daemon book and unfortunately it does very little to slow him down. Against a list with the faster models/ ranged units it would be even less effective.

I severely dislike Triarch praetorians, I strongly suggest dropping them for wraiths if you have them.

Personally I would drop the C'tan and all of the crypteks, giving all of the lords scythes and mindshackle scarabs, dropping the phase shifters where you have them (just too expensive for one wound models in my opinion)

If you have wraiths I would run them with your destroyer lord and use them for anti-monstrous creatures, giving the lord mindshackle where I could.

Alternatively I would drop the D-lord for an overlord with mindshackle scarabs, phase shifter, weave if its not a khorne heavy list, orb (removing it from one of your lords), and scythe (may be forgetting something here). Then take either 5 harbingers of destruction (2 with gaze), or 5 lords with scythes and scarabs.

I dunno, just my 2 cents from the last couple months of practicing for local level tournament play. (as in semi/non-hardcore)

[thecactusman17]

I would heavily suggest taking both Ghost Arks, as Daemons have a lot of trouble dealing with heavy armor of any kind. Plus the Guass arays are more of your excellent shooting. 20 Warriors, on the other hand, will fall in CC to 3/4 of his potential lists (everything but Tzeentch, and even that is likely to go against you).

HQ? Lord with a Scythe on a Barge would be good, but if you don't want to do that or have that, then just a dirt cheap shooting Overlord and the Phaeron upgrade will do wonders. No need for named characters in this list, shooting is the Daemon's greatest weakness.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

First of all, as it is the list is illegal. Unfortunately you cant have two royal courts if you take a destroyer lord, which is the true cost of the model.

Well, seeing as you can take 5 Crypteks and 5 Necron Lords per Royal Court, I fail to see how this is illegal. But thanks for pointing that out re the Tremorstaves. And I can see the logic of taking the mindshackle scarabs, as they will lessen the attacks able to be directed against the Necron lord, thus also acting in a defensive capacity for him, as well as directing more damage towards the attackers. I think I agree with the phase shifters, you're right there. Think I just wanted to protect the Res Orbs, if anything.

I don't see what the Harbingers of Destruction are going to bring to the fight. Gaze of flame is fairly useful, granted, but the Eldritch Lances are a waste against Invulnerable Saves, with the only vehicle being a Soulgrinder (if he takes them!).

I see what you're saying with the Wraiths, I just don't have them

Ghost Ark ... I think it's gotta be done. But I'm standing by my Destroyer Lord - may not work as well with Praetorians, but they've gotta be of some use, surely! So I'm gonna stick with this experiment, even if it doesn't sound good on paper - likely I'm wrong though!

[The Twilight Fade]

Eldritch Lances are a waste against Invulnerable Saves

I think this is where praetorians are going be a bad choice aswell, the main benefit of them is their AP2 shot and against anything except things with iron hide its also going to be wasted.

Eldritch lance is a solid choice as it is high strength and can strip 3+ saves from greater daemons at range when the praetorians are only strength 5 (correct me if im wrong), have no invulnerable save and need to be within 6" of the target.

A squad of Lychguard instead may provide something better as they have an invulnerable, high toughness and can provide a nice counter-charge if needed

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

I think this is where praetorians are going be a bad choice aswell, the main benefit of them is their AP2 shot and against anything except things with iron hide its also going to be wasted.

Eldritch lance is a solid choice as it is high strength and can strip 3+ saves from greater daemons at range when the praetorians are only strength 5 (correct me if im wrong), have no invulnerable save and need to be within 6" of the target.

A squad of Lychguard instead may provide something better as they have an invulnerable, high toughness and can provide a nice counter-charge if needed

Hmm...You could be right there. However, equipping them as I have with the voidblade/particle caster option means they can still shoot within 12" at S6 AND this gives them an extra attack. Plus, the Voidblade coupled with the Warscythe of the Destroyer would be a great Bloodcrusher/Soulgrinder hunting combo (provided they survive that long, thanks Initiative 2).

I know what you're saying about the Lychguard, but they just aren't mobile enough as a hit quad, which is what my thinking with the Destroyer/Praetorian unit was. Seriously, the Praetorians must be good for something, right? But I am starting to think that Wraiths are the way forward. At least they can savage a unit on a charge.

Again, Eldritch lances - why are my Warriors going to be shooting at Greater Daemons? As my Crypteks are attached to them, they will be putting in as many rounds as possible into Lesser Daemons, especially any Bloodletters and Daemonettes as possible.

[Kawauso]

Well, seeing as you can take 5 Crypteks and 5 Necron Lords per Royal Court, I fail to see how this is illegal.

Just wanted to point out that I think what was meant by the comment is that you have 2 court members in some squads.

You cannot add more than 1 model from a single royal court to a unit. If you had 2 courts, you could put one model from each court in the same unit, but with only 1 court you can only hand out 1 model to any particular unit.

Hence, taking the Destroyer Lord really is costly if you want to maximize your use of the Royal Court.

That being said, I've heard (no experience, yet) that the Destroyer Lord with a Res Orb in a unit of Praetorians is pretty good...and I'd be inclined to believe it.

[The Twilight Fade]

Again, Eldritch lances - why are my Warriors going to be shooting at Greater Daemons? As my Crypteks are attached to them, they will be putting in as many rounds as possible into Lesser Daemons, especially any Bloodletters and Daemonettes as possible.

Yeah fair enough, but somethings gotta fire at them at some point, it gives you some versatility and if any soul grinders appear the gauss shots won't be wasted either

Hmm...You could be right there. However, equipping them as I have with the voidblade/particle caster option means they can still shoot within 12" at S6 AND this gives them an extra attack. Plus, the Voidblade coupled with the Warscythe of the Destroyer would be a great Bloodcrusher/Soulgrinder hunting combo (provided they survive that long, thanks Initiative 2).

I actually forgot about voidblades and they are fearless aswell I guess. I always saw them for the rod of convent which is rather underwhelming to say the least...hmmm...if you try them be sure to feedback how they went!

Wraiths still may be better against lesser daemons due to invul and most greater deamons are only strength 6 so they won't get ID'd against them either, I've had wraiths win some ridiculous fights before!

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

. I always saw them for the rod of convent which is rather underwhelming to say the least...

You know, I thought exactly that too. What is the point of them? Then it hit me - imagine a unit of Praetorians jump packing within 6" of some Space Marine Terminators - S5, AP2, dead Termies on 3+s...gotta be worth 200 points for such a quick fix!

Oh, just realised the 5+ save. Well, still not bad, but best bolster them with some Wraiths to make combat more interesting I guess!