Special Power "axes"

[Mesi]

So, you ignored my options a and b.

And, glaive encarmines do not have unique rules, so are whatever they are modelled as.

Executioner's Axe has unique rules as I believe GW meant to define it (i.e. a weapon with rules that modify the S, I and AP).

You're trying to fit Unique rules into a very narrow definition. That's simply not the case. Any weapon that has multiple special rules is considered unique. Thus as a whole giving it unique special rules. Unique special rules do not mean a very specific rule that only applies to this weapon in this codex.

Glaives are unique, no other codex has them. They have multiple special rules, and are named unique weapons. Following the 'listed in unit entry' statement about what qualifies as a unique weapon. Unique weapon = unique rules, even if it's just a combination of multiple 'special rules'.

All Glaives are AP3 as well. As per the power weapon and Unique weapon rules. This debate is seriously silly now. You have no valid points anymore. The context of the rules is clear, seriously stop trying to take them out of context by accepting the narrowest definition of a word possible.

[Mesi]

"The word axe is largely irrelevant" In an argument deciding whether or not the Axe Mortalis is an axe.

Special and unique can not be interchanged in the real world.

Also, I don't think 'unique weapon' and 'weapon with unique rules' can be interchanged at any time. They say different things.

My child is special.
My child is unique.

In the real world, people will take both statements to mean the same thing. Why? Because in context they are the same thing, no one's going to bust out a dictionary and go no you're using that word wrong it very specifically means this. GW is the same way with their rules, its a rulebook written by a bunch of gamers. Not Websters Dictionary, or a team of Lawyers. The context is clear.

Again Axe Mortalis is the name of the weapon. It's entry very specifically states 'master crafted power weapon' Therefore, the word 'axe' has zero bearing on the weapons rules at all. If it was called 'Blade Mortalis' And was modeled as an axe, this wouldn't even be a topic of debate.

[Chris*ta]

2. Quoting an opponent's words out of context — i.e. choosing quotations that misrepresent the opponent's actual intentions (see fallacy of quoting out of context).[2]

See definition number two. "quoting words out of context" At least read what you're linking me before trying to say I'm wrong.

In this case people are taking the words unique, special, Axe Mortalis, out of context and using them to support their argument.

Read the whole of point 2. (see fallacy of quoting out of context)

Also, I don't think that "the words unique, special, Axe Mortalis" have been taken out of context at all.

Also, remember that I've said that the rules would allow you to treat it as a power sword (i.e. AP 3) if modelled appropriately and I'd be willing for you to treat it as a power sword even if not modelled appropriately.

[Chris*ta]

Any weapon that has multiple special rules is considered unique. Thus as a whole giving it unique special rules.

Doesn't the axe mortalis only have one special rule?

Also, you still haven't addressed points a and b

[Chris*ta]

My child is special.
My child is unique.

In the real world, people will take both statements to mean the same thing. Why? Because in context they are the same thing, no one's going to bust out a dictionary and go no you're using that word wrong it very specifically means this. GW is the same way with their rules, its a rulebook written by a bunch of gamers. Not Websters Dictionary, or a team of Lawyers. The context is clear.

Hardly "very specifically". The words mean different things. Unique: One of a kind. Special: Slightly out of the ordinary.

And GW has no history of using "unique rules" to mean the same thing as "special rules" anywhere else.

Also to me those two sentences mean entirely different things.
"My child is special."
My child has an intellectual disability

"My child is unique."
I'm up myself and my child has been raised with no boundaries at all.

[Mesi]

Doesn't the axe mortalis only have one special rule?

Also, you still haven't addressed points a and b

Point A is countered by the rules in the book. 'If no additional special rules' Since the weapon has additional special rules. You do not look to see what type of weapon it is. It could be modeled as unicorn or a severed arm. It wouldn't matter.

B. Is also covered by the rules. Since you don't look at the specific weapon the model is using it doesn't matter what the counts as has. So long as he has a melee weapon.

Power weapon is considered a special rule. Otherwise it would simply be 'melee weapon' Add on master crafted and you now have multiple special rules.

The power weapon rule clarifies what a unique weapon is. 'A power weapon with additional special rules' Unique power weapons follow the AP3 profile. If they wanted it to be a power axe, they would have FAQ'd it.

[Mesi]

Hardly "very specifically". The words mean different things. Unique: One of a kind. Special: Slightly out of the ordinary.

And GW has no history of using "unique rules" to mean the same thing as "special rules" anywhere else.

Also to me those two sentences mean entirely different things.
"My child is special."
My child has an intellectual disability

"My child is unique."
I'm up myself and my child has been raised with no boundaries at all.

You're only being argumentative to be argumentative at this point. The context of the rules are cut and dry. And this debate is going in circles because of over specification of word definitions. You need to be aware of how the masses operate. To the masses unique and special mean universally the same thing. Common people using common English interchange words with slightly different meanings to imply the same thing. Is it 100% grammatically correct? nope but it doesn't matter.

And since the rulebook is written in a common even laid back tone, you need to take the same approach to how words are used. If GW has specific meanings they in this rulebook have always pointed it out in some way.

It's only certain people who will argue the fine points of a word in general use as you are doing now to try and create a conflict that really doesn't exist.

[Chris*ta]

The power weapon rule clarifies what a unique weapon is. 'A power weapon with additional special rules' Unique power weapons follow the AP3 profile. If they wanted it to be a power axe, they would have FAQ'd it.

And you were accusing me of this: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_quoting_out_of_context[/url] .

Also, we need to keep the difference between a unique weapon and a weapon with unique rules very clear in this argument as people (not you) have previously tried to argue that they are the same thing.

[Chris*ta]

You're only being argumentative to be argumentative at this point. The context of the rules are cut and dry. And this debate is going in circles because of over specification of word definitions. You need to be aware of how the masses operate. To the masses unique and special mean universally the same thing. Common people using common English interchange words with slightly different meanings to imply the same thing. Is it 100% grammatically correct? nope but it doesn't matter.

And since the rulebook is written in a common even laid back tone, you need to take the same approach to how words are used. If GW has specific meanings they in this rulebook have always pointed it out in some way.

It's only certain people who will argue the fine points of a word in general use as you are doing now to try and create a conflict that really doesn't exist.

Really we should be arguing about the meaning of phrases: "special rules" and "unique rules". GW has never used these terms interchangeably before. (Please provide a counterexample if I'm wrong!)

"You're only being argumentative to be argumentative at this point." It's not cool to make accusations like that. Please don't.

[Mesi]

Really we should be arguing about the meaning of phrases: "special rules" and "unique rules". GW has never used these terms interchangeably before. (Please provide a counterexample if I'm wrong!)

"You're only being argumentative to be argumentative at this point." It's not cool to make accusations like that. Please don't.

Take the Glaive for example, it is a two handed master crafted power weapon. It has multiple special rules, which together give it a unique rule.

Since the Glaive is a power weapon with additional special rules. You cannot use the table to determine it's properties in the initial power weapon rule selection. This logically concludes that the combination of special rules makes it unique. And so follows the 'unusual' special weapons rules.

This line of thinking is supported by the Chaos and BA FAQs where they noted exceptions to this logic chain of rules in the Blood Crozius and Gorechild.