Stormraven as air-superiority fighter

[CrimsonTurkey]

I tried out a Stormraven with a twin-linked heavy bolter, twin-linked assault cannon, hurricane bolters, and psybolt ammunition the other day as an air superiority fighter, and I must say, this is a fun toy.

4 S6 Rending, 3 S6, and 6 or 12 S5 shots, all at BS4 with a re-roll to hit. Hull points simply disappear. Granted, I was up against AV 10/11 dark eldar flyers, but it was still very effective. My raven took down two voidravens before it started gunning for light/medium infantry.

Mathammer:
AV10 over 12": 2.96 pen/1.92 glance
AV10 under 12": 3.84 pen/2.81 glance

AV11 over 12": 1.04 pen/1.93 glance
AV11 under 12": 1.04 pen/2.82 glance

AV12: 0.59 pen/ 0.44 glance

I didn't factor in missiles, as I play Grey Knights and our missiles are a joke. Blood Angels would certainly have the option of firing missile instead of using the hurricane bolters when presented with Valks and other StormRavens.

Granted, mind strikes have gotten a lot better against certain opponents, since perils doesn't get a save anymore. Fire off all four to insta-gib hive tyrants.

[Thanatos_elNyx]

I really feel that Flyers should have been categorised into Interceptors and Bombers/Transports.

The Bombers/Transports shouldn't have the Skyfire rules, so while they can have a ton of guns, they would only be hitting the fast interceptors on 6s.
These guys would also be described as Heavy, so they can 'only' move 18" a turn, but are still super fast compared to ground vehicles

Interceptors would have Skyfire on all the time, so they can shoot other flyers on natural BS, but if they have to they can shoot at ground targets with Snap Fire.

But I digress.

SR were awesome and remain so.

[Bean]

Storm ravens were awesome and still are--their air superiority role will certainly make them eve more so.

However they're like expensive children's toys compared to vendettas. You get two vendettas for the price of one dakka raven, and they'll just chuckle to themselves as they off-handedly ruin it before going on to trounce the rest of your army. These, not those piddly de and necron flyers should be your concern, and there a multimelta is much better.

[DarkLink]

The thought of facing a Vendetta/Valkyrie spam army, or a Necron army with tons of flyers, is literally the only time in all the years I've played 40k where I have decided I would refuse to play my opponent, period. Flyers are stupid.

[Bean]

Yeah, they needed across-the-board price (and, in the case of the Valk/Vendetta) availability changes with sixth to account for the massive, unmitigated buff the rules gave them. Vendettas were already way underpriced compared to every comparable option. To give them such a huge boost in terms of core mechanics without changing their price at all was...a huge error. It really bugs me. Storm Raven probably could have used a price jump, too, but at least it's kinda close to being fair. Vendetta isn't even in the right ballpark.

[DarkLink]

The Storm Raven's all right. It's already extremely expensive, before it was just plain overpriced, and most armies should have enough firepower to bring down a single flyer with a little luck. You can't spam Storm Ravens. They're a solid choice, but the movement limitations on flyers and the price of the unit is enough to balance them out.

I'll just laugh when the 9 Vendetta d********g comes up against a Green Tide list.

[Iceman]

I'm not sure I agree. All you need to take care of a Vendetta is a quad-cannon. Four S7 attacks with rerolls has a good chance of inflicting the two hullpoint hits you need to take it down in one turn. Not to mention a few Space Marine squads with missile launchers shooting flakk missiles. Flyers merely add another dimension to your thought process as you put together your army list.

[Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer]

I'm not sure I agree. All you need to take care of a Vendetta is a quad-cannon. Four S7 attacks with rerolls has a good chance of inflicting the two hullpoint hits you need to take it down in one turn. Not to mention a few Space Marine squads with missile launchers shooting flakk missiles.

Nothing has Flakk missiles yet, and remember, the Quad-cannon can be destroyed (T7, 2 wounds, 3+ save, or mounted on a Bastion of some sort). Quad-cannons on defense lines will fold pretty much instantly to Vendettas, and Bastions aren't that safe either (although better dealt with by other Guard options).

[Chris Copeland]

The thought of facing a Vendetta/Valkyrie spam army, or a Necron army with tons of flyers, is literally the only time in all the years I've played 40k where I have decided I would refuse to play my opponent, period. Flyers are stupid.

I've heard the following said to many a player who complained about Gray Knights: "Get better. Adapt you tactics. Use better strategies."

[Bean]

Nothing has Flakk missiles yet, and remember, the Quad-cannon can be destroyed (T7, 2 wounds, 3+ save, or mounted on a Bastion of some sort). Quad-cannons on defense lines will fold pretty much instantly to Vendettas, and Bastions aren't that safe either (although better dealt with by other Guard options).

This, basically. The Aegis defense line is certainly good, but its quad cannon is not realistically going to pose much of a threat to a Vendetta. The Bastion doesn't really do any better.

Foot squads with Flakk missiles will almost certainly end up being one of the best answers, but they don't exist yet.

I've heard the following said to many a player who complained about Gray Knights: "Get better. Adapt you tactics. Use better strategies."

I get what you're saying, but I honestly think that flyers, as they exist right now, and with particular emphasis placed on the Vendetta (and, to a slightly lesser extent, the Valkyrie) are notably more broken than Grey Knights are (or ever were, frankly). It's a tough comparison to quantify, and I'm not really interested in trying, but that's my opinion.