7th edition already?

[Mr Mystery]

No offence taken.

You should see what happens when I really don't like someone's comedy.

[Cap'nSmurfs]

For the record (as someone who's been following this stuff on and off for fifteen years), of the current Developers (please forgive me if I miss anyone or get something wrong):

Ward has been around since the mid-00s. I want to say 2006.
Kelly was part of the WD team from 1998-99 or so, then he made the step up to Development in the early 00s. His first contribution was some fluff text on the then-current Codex Necrons (which I think was also Andy Chambers' last involvement).
Troke is also mid-00s. For a while there he was kind of bouncing around jobs, but he's back in the GD studio.
Cruddace is late 00s - I think he was new as of 2008-9. Around when Alessio left.
Jervis is older than Time Itself. But he was only brought back into the fold around 2007, basically to firefight while they reorganised Games Development. He's a senior figure in the studio and definitely one of GW's main links to their past and traditions, so if anyone was meant, it's him.
Vetock similarly has been around for ages, but I think he only officially joined Development as a full member around 2008, as well.

There's also a fair few people in Development who aren't designers as such, but do important things like editing. Check out the credits of a codex, there's a lot of people in the GD studio.

So, honestly, there's not really a lot of Old Guard left there. The people who might have been thought of as guardians of an old way of doing things - Andy Chambers (80s), Gav Thorpe (early 90s) and Alessio Cavatore (late 90s). And of those, Chambers loved experimental rules and different mechanics, but was also responsible for the Grand Streamlining (3rd) that gave us the basis of the ruleset still used, and Alessio was a hardened tournament player (it's why they hired him - he also ran an end of 5th ed Warhammer competition in White Dwarf to send in the most broken combinations you could think of, specifically so he could splat them in the next edition!) The studio went through a phase of reorganisation around 2007-2008; it's telling that while 5th was a somewhat austere audition in terms of rules (it was Alessio's baby, and he left upon its completion after a year or so of writing FAQs), all of the subsequent codices were bringing back old stuff and adding in more of the weird and wonderful 40k things. We should've seen the writing on the wall when Space Marines brought back Digital Weapons and the Thudd Gun (by a new name) - and subsequently we also found ourselves with IG psykers again, rad grenades, Jokaero... and now overwatch is back, in a new, streamlined form.

The things some people don't like - random elements, "imbalance" - aren't there because GD is necessarily dysfunctional and/or waiting for all the old amateurs to move on. It's because that crop of designers has a philosophy and they've been working together for it since about 2008. Most of them are about the same age, they mostly grew up playing Rogue Trader, 2nd ed, and all the games GW used to do. They're writing something in that style - a heavily narrative tabletop wargame with roleplaying game elements, designed to be played to tell exciting stories in the 41st millennium. I like 6th because that's what I'm about too. But the idea they don't know what they're doing, that they don't know what tournaments need, or they're uninterested in that style of play is just not true - they're often successful tournament players themselves (Kelly has a reputation especially for being a very handy player) so it's not true that they don't know what tournament players want. It's just that the tournament/competitive aspect is not the core of the game. It's one way of several in which it can be played. The core philosophy, though, is the narrative, the visuals, and the experience, and that's what they're writing to.

Or that's my take

(which turned out to be FAR TOO LONG D: )

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

Of course I'm going to stand up for my friends.

[Skeith154]

Eldargal, while your use of words was certainly impressive, and i could actually understand it.who exactly speaks like that even remotely any more? it had this distinct british tone to it that makes me wanna give up any arguements just to silence the speaker.(useful tactics...)

[wittdooley]

Eldargal, while your use of words was certainly impressive, and i could actually understand it.who exactly speaks like that even remotely any more? it had this distinct british tone to it that makes me wanna give up any arguements just to silence the speaker.(useful tactics...)

So....what you're saying is British people. What a coincidence, as she's British.

[Skeith154]

oh i'm well aware she's british, but rather all those big words strung together gave it a certain tone that i personally would not want to have to match up against in an argument. though thanks for stating the obvious.

[DarkLink]

He might have been referring more to the playtesters than the big name designers, the guys that would sit down with Ward and the bunch after playtesting games and discuss what's up for them to change. The specific quote I had was when Reece asked about some broken, overpowered combo. The developer said 'well, we just didn't think people would actually abuse it so we didn't bother fixing it'. Frankly, that seems to fit in with 6th's design philosophy, and frankly, lack of concern for balance is an objective problem. There's no reason you can't have cooky fun rules and balance at the same time. That's the issue with the current design philosophy that I'm talking about, and it's pretty hard to argue that that doesn't exist. It also explains why GW does such a poor job with their FAQs, if the developers don't care that much about closing loopholes and patching imbalances. The old-fashioned design philosophy also extended to GW's reluctance to adopt things like digital media even though it's clearly becoming a vital area of just about any market involving intellectual property.

As for the part about the young guys, you remember that leaked document that people thought was 6th. Well, it wasn't 6th, and no, it wasn't even really an early version, but it did come from GW. And from what I heard, it did sound like there were a lot of guys within the studio more than willing to embrace improved game and community support and step into the digital age, so GW has a good chance of saving itself from that path to failure if it is willing to innovate.

No offence taken.

You should see what happens when I really don't like someone's comedy.

Heh, you should see when I actually get self-righteous. That GW IP China whatever thread a while back was one awesome train wreck. No wonder I got along with Melissia so well before she disappeared.

The internet always just sounds so serious all the time.

[Sacrean]

Exscuce me, But I was always under the impression that GW never set out to make a game that is comepletely balanced. for them to do so would involve once a new edition came out they would have to release all the dex's at the same time, written for the new rule set. and then not change anything because that would upset the balance. Does this mean that certain armies get the shaft. Hell yeah. is it fair hell no.

But who said life or anything in it would be fair. This isn't like an MMO where things can be changed on the fly. And before someone says FaQ's, if they hastily fix one thing it may actually cause much larger problems in many other fields. plain and simple the challenge is what makes this game fun. I would lose interest and quit if I just walked all over my enemies.

I admit that I did not read the article. So I will say nothing about it. But people need to get over themselves and thier armies old supiriority and learn to adapt. It's something that real armies have had to do thousands of times in the past and will have to do coutlesstimes more. and thats what we are doing. We are playing war. So the rules of engagement has changed. Suck it up and deal. Everyone else is having to as well.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

You mean to say that a British person was condescending in an argument? Us? Never. In all seriousness, she was referencing her earlier comment. 'with your big words and your small complicated words'. She's trollin' Chumbalaya.

[eldargal]

Yes I was poking fun at Chumbawumba, though I do have a tendency to be more verbose than necessary sometimes. I try to rein it online. It does seem to have an odd impact on Americans especially when combined with my accent.