Random assaulting debate that shouldn't even need to be debated

[Squidy]

Yes, another thread about 6th. Sorry, but I've played it enough and I'm still disappointed in GW.

The fact that you have to get across the table and then leave it up to dice as to whether you get to do anything or not is just... well dumb.

Oh sure, the average is better, but failed charges happen on a regular basis. A 6" move would be much better than having 2D6 because at least you're not leaving it to the dice to determine how good you do.


The main reason for this thread is to keep the fire alive. I don't like where GW is heading with my game and I think they need to know what they are doing wrong.

Now, this may sound crazy, but I liked the 5th edition rule book. Most people complained, but it simplified things and allowed for more balanced gameplay. Granted, they screwed it up with all the crazy codexes, but I liked the rule book in general.

Now, anyone who isn't saying good things about 6th is a cry baby. I'm tired of GW ruining my game, but I like 40k so much I'm not about to quit. Re-writing everything is the best idea I can come up with. You know, a book entirely of house rules. That's how disappointed the direction 6th headed for.

So, you guys with me? I don't mean to hurt anybody, I just want Warhammer 40k to be fun. And if you disagree, state your opinion. No need to insult. If I wrote anything to offend, just tell me and I will edit it (unless I can't for some reason). Mod, find this to be spam, just dump it and I'm sorry ahead of time.

[alshrive]

while i respect your personal opinion, my personal opinion is that you are wrong. I quite like the style of the game now, and find that it feels more cinematic and grand. that failed charge isn't down to bad luck, that failed charge is my warriors balking at the sight of their potential death, it is that costly slip on unstable ground or that moment of hesitation the sort of "wtf am i doing" moment. The same can be said for the ridiculously lucky charges; it is a warrior spurred on by vengeance for his dead battle brothers or simply sheer insanity (if i run really quick the bullets won't hit me)!

I understand that some people don't like the new rules, but i myself, prefer them.

[Wolfshade]

I think that with the ability to premeasure everything all movement lost it's random element, the is it or isn't it in range.
The trouble with that system is that some people are really good a learning to judge by eye the distances you can move/assault/shoot and unfortunately it is not a skill that everyone has or can improve.
So for that reason the random charges I like, I thought I wouldn't as I play mainly assaulting armies.
I think everyone loves the rules that they first learnt to play, for me that was 2nd ed, and with my rose tinted glasses on it was brilliant, though, in reality large games were a nightmare, assault with more that 5 people became a headache and shooting vehicles was always interesting. 3rd edition I loathed with a passion, so much so after buying the rule book and playing 4 games I stopped wargaming althogether, then 4th came and that was a huge improvement, 5th then streamlined 4th and introduced the revolution LoS which was a breath of fresh air, though to be fair a lot of people had been playing with true los for a while. 6th comes and it's shaken everything up again, it isn't a huge change as 2nd to 3rd but still a step with the random charges, random pyshic powers and flyers galore. I think until more 6th ed codecii drop we wo'n't really understand where we sit.

But certainly if you like to tweak it in a terms of houserules to get the fun back and your friends feel the same way why the hell not, it's your hobby

[Psychosplodge]

Well I still miss 2nd...

[inquisitorsog]

The trouble with that system is that some people are really good a learning to judge by eye the distances you can move/assault/shoot and unfortunately it is not a skill that everyone has or can improve.

Even though I'm pretty good at judging distances myself, I've always felt that relying on guesses on distances was patently unfair and designed to make new players feel bad. It's a skill most people can learn, so in addition to the tactical know-how and what not, an experience player gets another significant advantage against many new players.

I'm not sure that random rolls completely replace that, but I think they could have used a narrower curve such as d6+3 instead of 2d6. At any rate, I don't lose sleep over it. It's a change to the game we both have to play with, so it washes out.

I'm a little more concerned about random psychic powers to be honest. It was one thing I hated in fantasy back when I played it as it carries a whole lot of "what army am I bringing today?" with it. the fact that there's some defaulting helps, but still, it feels like randomly choosing your heavy weapons to me.

[Wolfshade]

My greatest 2nd ed moment was when a 30 man deathcompany charge 4 greater demons...

[Psychosplodge]

My greatest was a SM sergeant rolling near continuous sixes to destroy a brood of genestealers...

[RealGenius]

So, you guys with me? I don't mean to hurt anybody, I just want Warhammer 40k to be fun. And if you disagree, state your opinion.

Nice first post.

No, not with you. Variability makes the game more fun for me, because it levels the playing field between funsies players and hardcore players.

With 6th you introduce many potentially abusive elements: double FOC, Allied contingents, etc. To balance, you add many variable elements: mysterious terrain, warlord traits, random charge distance. 5th was good; 6th is better. Embrace all the rules, because if you pick and choose it doesn't work as well.

If you are failing charges, then you need to adjust your gameplay to 6th edition. If you want a guaranteed charge, get within 2". The game is different now.

[isotope99]

There is some variability but if you play assuming a charge range of 5", you will only fail 1/6 of the time over open ground (equivalent of a 2+), often enough to frustrate but no more than any other unlucky 1's that pop up during the game.

Overall, the occasional hero charges are enough to offset the occasional facepalm moments for me at least.

My biggest bugbears at the moment with 6th are:

Pointless slapfight challenges
Rallying within 6" making it impossible to run someone off the board

[Emerald Rose Widow]

House ruling would be a good way for you to get back to the fun, but you could say all this until you are blue in the face and I doubt GW would do a thing about it. Even when the majority of the community agrees on something or not, GW still ignores us, they will do what they want and they have already invested a LOT of money into 6th edition, and are making a lot in return. I respect your opinion, but I am just saying this because you are likely wasting your time if you think GW is going to change 6th edition because it takes away the fun for you. GW tends to just not care unless it hurts their financial base, which 6th edition has clearly not.

Personally I love random charges, they give me those momentary excitement of "I am taking this risk, am I going to make it?" or the occasional "dude if this guy fails his charge range, not only do I get to shoot him, but I can turn this around." I personally enjoy it a lot.

So my advice, just find people who agree with you and just house rule it, it will just be easier on you guys than forever petitioning a company who wont listen.