Is 6th Edition too good?

[jonsgot]

I've been struggling with 6th Edition for a while. I've found it very hard to work out why. I'm painting like I was before, I like my armies more than I did before. The rules don't appear to be frustrating like 5th. Every game doesn't threaten to end as a draw like 5th, Close combat isn't over powering like 4th, The rules have depth (looking at you 3rd), The armies and rules aren't over complicated (2nd edition) and you don't need a Games Masters. The use of allies has opened up something like 40 odd combinations of forces for me to play with. So by all rights I should be gaming every night and enjoying the fresh air that 6th edition has brought, but I'm not. The last game I played was weeks ago and I haven't got one planned.

Is 6th Ed too good? Is it like a Ford Mondeo, it just works, but without the possibility you might not reach you destination (like a Mk1 Escort or an Alpha) the excitement has just gone? I hope not. Or is 6th a bit too much like 2nd where games take so long they are daunting and one side can once again wiping the fall with the opposition ending in frustration? I think I've only lost 1 game so far.

Or am I just having a off quarter and I just need to get a few more games in?

[bethor]

Its funny that you posted this. My buddies and I are all kind of in the same boat. I've been painting and modelling more since 6th edition, but when it comes time to play a game, we usually break out dust or warmachine. I think a lot of it has to do with time. We can play reasonably large games of either of them in less than 90 minutes.
We used to play 2000 point games of 40k in 2 hours or less. When you factor in rolling up everything and setting up terrain, our 1500 point games are taking longer than 2 hours, and when they are over we aren't in the mood to set up a next game.

I'm not sure what the issue is. I've never had the major complaints that others have had about 6th. It just doesn't have the spirit of an old 40k game.

[The Sovereign]

Lots of things I like this edition, but I wouldn't say it's too good. IMO challenge rules don't work, for instance.

[Kyban]

My biggest problem is the time, the games take too long and there are some unnecessary additions in this edition. The set up takes a while and I think people are still trying to get a handle on using the new rules quickly.

Lots of things I like this edition, but I wouldn't say it's too good. IMO challenge rules don't work, for instance.

What about the challenge rules don't you like?

[Dalleron]

I don't think that 6th edition is too good. It is better than 5th edition most definitely, but there is alot of extra stuff in the rules that don't need to be there. Things like mysterious objectives and mysterious terrain. I don't even want to go off on a tirade about random charges in wide open terrain.

[bethor]

I think the random charge length may be part of the soul suck to 6th. That and the random snap fire.
It's the randomness that hurts. It usually is just fine, put when you fail that important charge from 3.5", or you take 6 casualties from snap fire from dumb luck...it makes that 2.5 hours feel wasted, and the guy that won due to your charge dice coming up 1 2 doesn't feel like he beat you...it feels like the game beat you.

[Kyban]

I think the random charge length may be part of the soul suck to 6th. That and the random snap fire.
It's the randomness that hurts. It usually is just fine, put when you fail that important charge from 3.5", or you take 6 casualties from snap fire from dumb luck...it makes that 2.5 hours feel wasted, and the guy that won due to your charge dice coming up 1 2 doesn't feel like he beat you...it feels like the game beat you.

I definitely agree with this. I don't like having a lot of randomness, it detracts from any strategy the game has.

[ElectricPaladin]

I think that random charge length and premeasuring are the two things that most saved 40k for me.

Random charge length and overwatch makes charging into a very clear game of risk management. It's very tactical, and just in the way I like it. Do you want to get into close combat? Well... it's a risk. I don't think it adds a lot of randomness to the game - certainly not any more than failing BS or WS rolls! - but it does change the focus of the game. Assaulting isn't the sure-fire victory tactic it used to be. It's a risky proposition, potentially useful, but no longer the game winner.

[Kyban]

I think that random charge length and premeasuring are the two things that most saved 40k for me.

Random charge length and overwatch makes charging into a very clear game of risk management. It's very tactical, and just in the way I like it. Do you want to get into close combat? Well... it's a risk. I don't think it adds a lot of randomness to the game - certainly not any more than failing BS or WS rolls! - but it does change the focus of the game. Assaulting isn't the sure-fire victory tactic it used to be. It's a risky proposition, potentially useful, but no longer the game winner.

I like the premeasuring and the random charge length is fine if you're using it to shoot for a difficult charge with the risk of being shot without making it but there should definitely be protection from easy failed charges imo. When your 4" and fail a charge in clear terrain it just feels like a big kick in the shin from luck that your opponent had nothing to do with, but if you take the risk and pull of a big charge it's much more exiting and should be where the risk lies.

[oink]

The randomness has really brought 40K back to life. It has brought in an element of being in the right place at the right time as well as a new type of strategic play (risk management). This is much better for the game than before (which was basically simple math) because you have lots of variables to weigh up.

Everyone used to love talking about mathammer and working out average rolls needed to be able to kill something... yet those same people seem to baulk at random movement and no longer bother about the "average" they used to hold so dear! If they did they'd simply be exclaiming that they can now charge 7-8 inches instead of only 6!

There is a lot of good in this edition, but yes a lot of the new stuff wasn't really ironed out. I suppose for the most part we should expect that. The rules that are good and work well didn't get like that overnight - we've gone through several editions of ironing out those creases!

The trouble for us though, is that there have been enough changes to make the game play very differently, and it can be a struggle to adapt. It's certainly not always a quick process for everyone.