Thinking about starting Warmachine/Hordes, need some help.

[RGilbert26]

Evening all, im thinking about starting either Warmachine or Hordes and i was wondering if i could get some help from those of you who play it. Ive tried going to both websites but it's being slow for me.

Could someone tell me the difference between the two games?
How big do armies get?
What they are made out of?

etc, etc

Thanks.

[armchair autarch]

[Sorry for brevity, but I'm at work atm]

So the main difference between warmachine and hordes is the focus and fury mechanics respectively.

In Warmachine, each turn your caster gets X amounts of foucs to use as he wishes during his turn. Before he starts his turn he can out some focus to Warjacks to allow them to also do cool things. Jacks can spend focus to charge, do power attacks, buy more attacks, or "boost" rolls which is basically adding a d6 to a roll to increase the outcome. A warcaster can also use his focus to buy more attacks or boost rolls, but he can also choose to use his focus to cast spells which are listed on his card. A warcaster can also "camp" focus to increase his Armor, making him more durable, by 1 point of ARM per foucs camped. At the beginning of each subsequent turn, unused focus is discarded and you gain focus back to your starting amount to hand out and use all over again.

In Hordes, a Warlock and his beast act much differently. Beasts are "forced" to charge, power attack, boost or buy more attacks. By being forced they accumulate fury rather than spend allocated focus. Each beast can accumulate fury up to his fury stat [3 for lights, 4/5 for heavies]. At the begining of each turn [except the first turn when a warlock starts with full fury] a warlock discards his current fury and "leaches" fury from beasts that was accumulated in the previous turn. Any excess fury is left on the beasts and they could potentially rage out.

The traditional breakdown that people use is that Warmachine is resource management and Hordes is risk management. I find that a bit oversimplified but its the best I can do at the moment.

Hope it helps!

[Dyrnwyn]

Evening all, im thinking about starting either Warmachine or Hordes and i was wondering if i could get some help from those of you who play it. Ive tried going to both websites but it's being slow for me.

Could someone tell me the difference between the two games?
How big do armies get?
What they are made out of?

etc, etc

Thanks.

Welcome to the game! I'll try to post a very basic rundown.

The games run off of largely the same system. All the major rules between the two are shared, and you can play a game with a Hordes army against a Warmachine army. For this reasons a lot of fans just call the game 'Warmahordes' since it's essentially one system. The difference in rules is on the primary mechanic.

In Warmachine, you have a warcaster who controls a battlegroup of warjacks (big steampunk robots). Every turn a Warcaster generates a set amount of Focus, 6-7 being average. Focus is used to make warjacks run, charge, use special attacks, or power up normal attacks, spent by the caster to cast spells, or held onto to boost the caster's armor. As you can see, you're looking at distributing a limited resource, but it has a constant output.

In Hordes, you have a warlock who controls a battlegroup of warbeasts. A Warlock does not generate his spellcasting resource, called Fury. Instead, when one of his beasts wants to do something that would require Focus to be spent in Warmachine (boosting attacks, power attacks, running, etc.), that beast gains a Fury token. At the start of the turn, a warlock may leech Fury from his beasts up to his FURY value. Any beasts with Fury left on them after this happens have to make a check to see if they Frenzy, and if they fail, you lose control of the beast for a turn while it follows a specific flow chart on who it will attack. Warlocks spend Fury to cast spells, and instead of getting higher armor from held Fury, can spend it to transfer damage from an attack on them over to one of their beasts, so long as the beast isn't full up on Fury.

The oft put comparison is that Warmachine is about managing a resource and Hordes is about managing risk.

Armies can vary wildly - starter boxes which usually value 11-13 points are between 3 and 6 models. Game sizes are Battlebox, 15, 25, 35 and 50 points. Most games at my local store are 35 points, and 35 and 50 are both tournament values. How many models you need will vary depending on how many Jacks/Beasts your caster is capable of handling, and how much infantry you plan on bringing. My first Circle Oroboros force in Hordes had only 9 models at 35 points. Caster, 5 beasts, one 3-model unit. By contrast, my friend's Cryx army at the same points level has around 30 models.

The vast majority of PP models are pewter, though all of the starter boxes and most of the jacks and beasts are available in PP's 'restic' material which is a resin/plastic mix that's non-toxic, but doesn't take plastic glue at all. You'll need superglue.

[RGilbert26]

Thanks for the reply, i finally got to the joint website last night and instantly found i didnt like the way it was setup. I find the GW easy to understand and generally answers any questions i might have (or should i say, did have as now i know what im after). Would be nice if their website properly showed people what their models looked like and other things.

There's a store that sells Warmachine/Hordes just 5 mins away by train so and they play it there, so if i do get into it then i know where to buy the stuff. I don't like metal models and so i think i'll just stick to the starter boxes and jacks/beasts :P

As i wasn't able to find the right info on my last visit to the website, do you have links to the rules and 'army books'?

PP doesn't really make it that easy to find them i feel.

Thanks.

[Dyrnwyn]

Thanks for the reply, i finally got to the joint website last night and instantly found i didnt like the way it was setup. I find the GW easy to understand and generally answers any questions i might have (or should i say, did have as now i know what im after). Would be nice if their website properly showed people what their models looked like and other things.

There's a store that sells Warmachine/Hordes just 5 mins away by train so and they play it there, so if i do get into it then i know where to buy the stuff. I don't like metal models and so i think i'll just stick to the starter boxes and jacks/beasts :P

As i wasn't able to find the right info on my last visit to the website, do you have links to the rules and 'army books'?

PP doesn't really make it that easy to find them i feel.

Thanks.

Privateer has all of the models they sell on it's website - they're organized by game and faction. [URL="http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/gallery"]Warmachine[/URL], and [URL="http://privateerpress.com/hordes/gallery"]Hordes[/URL]. There's pictures and info blocks telling you MSRP, model material, unit type etc. Some models even have 3D rotations available. Not sure exactly what you were looking for that you couldn't find. Maybe you're running a script blocker that kept you from seeing the left hand menu?

Quickstart rules are available online for both [URL="http://privateerpress.com/hordes/the-game"]Hordes[/URL] and [URL="http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/the-game"]Warmachine[/URL]. They only include the rules for battlegroups, ignoring units, solos and terrain, and contain some simplified rules.

Warmachine's rules setup is very different from GW - you will need the main rulebook (Either MkII Prime for Warmachine or MkII Primal for Hordes) but the 'Forces of X' army books aren't necessary. They provide you with the majority of your units' rules, but those rules are also duplicated on the stat card that comes with whatever model you happen to buy. If you want to read up more on the background of your chosen faction, they're great resources, but the 'army books' are not required to play. The one thing they do offer is the theme lists for casters - these are restricted unit lists that casters can choose to take on to represent the particular force they lead. They offer 4 minor mechanical or tactical benefits for taking particular units. However, these themes can usually be found by poking around online - [URL="http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/"]Battle College[/URL] has most of them.

Also, the Forces of X books don't contain all the units for your faction, as Privateer's expansion strategy involves releasing a new book with some new units for all factions and an update on the ongoing story, rather than a rotating revamp of one faction at a time. Current expansion books for Warmachine are Wrath and Colossals, and Hordes has Domination and Gargantuans.

[FarsightDesign]

Also, even though all the forces of X books do not include all the models you don't need to buy all the books to play the game. Each model has all the info on the stat card that you need to use it. All you really need is the basic rule book. They also have a phone/tablet app (that has its problem) that has every card for every faction. It's updated with each new release.

[GoodOleBoy01]

If you've got access to a phone/tablet that can run it, I'd highly recommend getting their War Room app and sniffing around the Free content (aka starter box cards). That'll give you an idea of what each faction looks/feels like. War Room has its issues, but I'm able to run it on a Galaxy S3 with no problems. If not, or even instead, you can look at the PP Forums at: [url]http://privateerpressforums.com/forumdisplay.php?16-WARMACHINE-and-HORDES[/url] and focus on the "about our faction" stickies that are at the top of most sections. They'll have wierd names like "For Kith and Kriel" when looking at Trollbloods, but the info is all there. Google "Warmachine Battlecollege" for even more/better discourse on how factions/models work. After you've picked a faction or two that you like, I'd get at least one of the starter boxes. Don't worry about templates, etc. - Privateer Press has a TON of free templates on their forums that you can print out. Assuming you've got 5-6 D6s laying around you can take your assembled starter box, printed templates and dice and have at it!