BA with SW Allies. Need criticism.

[Chris Lee]

Hey guys! First time poster here. I'm a new-ish player returning back for 6th ed. but I've done a fair bit of reading and played about 10 games now. I'm a Blood Angels player but I feel with the new 6th edition rules that they're a little bit lacking. I wanted to beef them up with some of the Space Wolves' exceptional troops/heavy support choices as well as a proper melee HQ (blood angel captains are absolute trash). My local meta is fairly competitive and my biggest worry is that I have no flyer defense. I don't own a stormraven and really dislike flyers.

Here's the list. Thoughts are to have the wolf lord join in one of the assault squads, and use the line of preds to provide cover for the advancing assault marines while the grey hunters, long fangs, and vindi hold the backline/midfield objectives. As I see it the major weaknesses are deepstriking units into my backline, and flyers.

Blood Angels Primary Force
HQ (250pts)

Mephiston, Lord of Death (250pts)

Elites (190pts)

Sanguinary Priest (95pts)x2
Jump Pack, Melta Bombs, Power Axe

Troops (460pts)

Assault Squad (230pts)
Meltagun x 2, Power Axe, Meltabombs

Assault Squad (230pts)
Meltagun x 2, Power Axe, Meltabombs

Fast Attack (435pts)

Baal Predator (145pts)
Heavy Bolters, Twin Linked Assault Cannon

Baal Predator (145pts)
Heavy Bolters, Twin Linked Assault Cannon

Baal Predator (145pts)
Heavy Bolters, Twin Linked Assault Cannon


Space Wolf Allies Detachment
HQ (245pts)

Wolf Lord (250pts)
Wolftooth Necklace, Frost Axe, Jump Pack, Ruinic Armor, Storm Shield, Saga of the Bear

Troops (175pts)

Grey Hunters Pack (175pts)
10x Grey Hunter
7x Bolter, Plasma Gun x2, Power Axe

Heavy Support (255 pts)

Long Fangs Pack (140pts)
5x Long Fang with Missile Launcher, Squad Leader- Bolter

Vindicator (115)

[Learn2Eel]

How many fliers do you see in your meta? If they are rare at best, then you needn't worry if that is where you mostly play. The one you will need to be most mindful of is the Heldrake; the baleflamer can potentially annihilate entire squads - though it is good that you have the Sanguinary Priests to dish out Feel No Pain, however you can still expect five to seven to die depending on how many are hit by a template at any given time. That it also vector strikes at strength seven and hits the side armour (11) of your vehicles is a big issue too.

Your army is very mobile, which is definitely a good thing. I'm a bit miffed personally (this isn't a competitive criticism by the way) that your Wolf Lord isn't mounted on a Thunderworlf, but eh, if you can't fit it in, you can't fit it in. Your army is built pretty much as I would expect it, though I must admit I am not overly familiar with Blood Angels in 6th Edition. Mephiston is a beast, no doubt, but I feel that a Librarian may be a better and cheaper option. He does add a lot of target saturation to your army, but be mindful that 2+ armoured characters - such as Abaddon, Draigo and even monsters such as the Dreadknight - can ruin Mephiston's day if they manage to wound you. He can't solo Terminator units as he once did, but he should cut through Tactical Squads and the like with impunity.

It looks solid given you don't want to include flyers or flyer defence. If you do find that you need the flyer defence though, I would get rid of the Wolf Lord in favour of a Rune Priest with Divination and take an Aegis Defence Line with a quad gun. Again, I'm not a big Blood Angels player, so I'm not a massive help here. For the Space Wolves contingent though, I do genuinely think a Rune Priest is the more effective option. If it does turn out that fliers are a bigger issue than you feared, a Stormraven would likely be a priority inclusion, in conjunction (if necessary) either with an Aegis Defence Line or a second Stormraven.

[Chris Lee]

Thanks so much for the input. The flyers tend to be Stormravens and Vendettas around here, with one Necron player that maxes out on flyers.

I like the idea of perhaps dropping Mephiston for a regular libby, and using the spare points on an aegis line. Meph brings a ton to the table, but I think subbing in a regular librarian might be nice for either divination powers or a Blood Lance/Shield combo for some extra punch on one of the assault squads. 500 points for 2 HQs might be a bit much anyway. I would be a little sore to ditch the Wolf Lord as I feel that what my assault squads are falling short in is.. well, the assult. I have a Sgt. there to eat a challenge if it isn't something I want the lord to get into, and he would bring a lot of hurt in CC.

I love the thunderwolf cav. but I am somewhat restricted budget wise and I couldn't really justify adding them with how pricey the models are. If I ever branch out into a pure space wolf force I will definitely pick them up.

[Learn2Eel]

No worries!

Well, that is good in a sense. Heldrakes are really the last thing almost any player wants to face, particularly an army such as yours. The fliers you regularly face aren't so much an issue for your bulky squads, but they sure as heck will frighten your characters and vehicles.

I agree. Mephiston is strong, but a Divination-using Librarian is probably a safer bet. I am divided on the Wolf Lord as such a build is really best suited for a Thunderwolf, owing to the stat boosts and the guaranteed twelve inch movement with re-rolls of charge distance to get into the thick of it as quickly as possible. Plus, it would give your army another "scary" unit to make up for Mephiston's loss. I can understand if you don't want Thunderwolf Cavalry though, they certainly are expensive.

[gwensdad]

Can I ask why you're using a Wolf Vindicator and not a BA one?

[sangrail777]

yo gwensdad, I would assume because a BA vindicator costs 145 and the SW vindicator costs 115. Sound about right Chris?

Ok the main problem I see with this list that jumps out at me is your HQ's Mephiston has to role solo and your Wolf Lord with a JP is either solo as well or trying to tag on with an assault SQ. Just leaves alot of room to have your expensive HQ's killed off by long range fire before they get the chance to make up thier points. I also suggest changing the Wolf Lord over to Thunderwolf. If you choose to use a regular Lib for your BA's I would also suggest useing the spare points for a rhino to give your Grey Hunters some mobility, course if you do get the aegis line that works too.

[desert_hack]

Like the list, just a couple of bits. You can take only one heavy slot for your allied detachment, so the vindicator is out. Use the extra points to get a divination librarian, and put them with your long fangs. This solves the problem of your anti air, by effectively twin linking your missile launchers - ie if you fail to hit on a 6, you re-roll.

[Chris Lee]

Ok the main problem I see with this list that jumps out at me is your HQ's Mephiston has to role solo and your Wolf Lord with a JP is either solo as well or trying to tag on with an assault SQ.

Yeah. My initial plan was to have the wolf lord join an assault squad so that he could boost their cc ability while benefiting from the Sang. Priest buffs and giving them counterattack. Meph as always has to fly solo, but he always either absorbs a ton of enemy firepower or gets ignored and causes some real havoc in a backline.

I'm thinking that I should reconfigure things in a way that frees up enough points to take the lord on a thunderwolf and pick up an aegis line. I'll probably have to drop meph and maybe a baal pred.

Like the list, just a couple of bits. You can take only one heavy slot for your allied detachment, so the vindicator is out. Use the extra points to get a divination librarian, and put them with your long fangs. This solves the problem of your anti air, by effectively twin linking your missile launchers - ie if you fail to hit on a 6, you re-roll.

Ahhh! That totally slipped my mind. I was hoping to take the SW Vindi as while it's not Fast like the BA, I save 30pts on it. The div libby could be really neat, though I'd worry about my ability to deal with terminator blobs without a vindi in my list. Those things have netted me stupid amounts of kills in past games. Damned Grey Knights and Dark Angels players are an infestation around here.

[Denzark]

Need criticism? OK - you should have posted this in the army list section of the forum.

[Chris Lee]

Need criticism? OK - you should have posted this in the army list section of the forum.

Sorry babe. New to the site. It's good to know that it isn't without its own impolite nerd population, though. Gaming just wouldn't be the same if I didn't get to deal with socially stunted manchildren on a daily basis.