Independent Characters Joining the Riptide

[Tynskel]

Hey BoLS,

Kirby ::barf:: ::fart::, has stated that ICs can join the Riptide because it can have drones, making it a 'multi-model unit'.

Is this the case?
I think not. Why?

Drones are a special circumstance to the normal rules for 40k.

A commander takes 2 drones as wargear. Now this is a 3 model unit, and only one model has the IC rule. However, the Tau Codex makes an exception that the drones do not count for the purposes of joining squads. Essentially, the Commander unit 'counts as' a single model for the purposes of the IC rule.

Since this is the case, the inverse of the rule should be applied to all models taking drones as war gear, for consistency.

A Riptide that takes Missile Drones should 'count as' a 'single model unit'. No ICs can join the Riptide.

[OrksOrksOrks]

Hey BoLS,

Kirby ::barf:: ::fart::, has stated that ICs can join the Riptide because it can have drones, making it a 'multi-model unit'.

Is this the case?
I think not. Why?

Drones are a special circumstance to the normal rules for 40k.

A commander takes 2 drones as wargear. Now this is a 3 model unit, and only one model has the IC rule. However, the Tau Codex makes an exception that the drones do not count for the purposes of joining squads. Essentially, the Commander unit 'counts as' a single model for the purposes of the IC rule.

Since this is the case, the inverse of the rule should be applied to all models taking drones as war gear, for consistency.

A Riptide that takes Missile Drones should 'count as' a 'single model unit'. No ICs can join the Riptide.

The problem here is that you're playing a different game from Kirby, you're playing to the spirit of the game, making sensible decisions to fit with the flavour of the game and taking the rules with an aim to work towards what is intended, Kirby and his followers are playing a non competitive game to win, they're going to twist and turn everything and take as many things literally as they can, even if it ignores playing in the spirit of the game, as long as it fits the literal interpretation of the rules, they'll do it (as long as they ignore that page in the rulebook that says you're meant to be friendly and ensure both players have fun)

[Magpie]

Spirit of the game not with standing, it does say pretty clearly that an IC can join a unit consisting only of drones and that the drones are very much considered additional members of a unit, so that does make it look pretty clear that a Riptide with drones can be joined by an IC.

[Tynskel]

The problem here is that you're playing a different game from Kirby, you're playing to the spirit of the game, making sensible decisions to fit with the flavour of the game and taking the rules with an aim to work towards what is intended, Kirby and his followers are playing a non competitive game to win, they're going to twist and turn everything and take as many things literally as they can, even if it ignores playing in the spirit of the game, as long as it fits the literal interpretation of the rules, they'll do it (as long as they ignore that page in the rulebook that says you're meant to be friendly and ensure both players have fun)

They are not taking things as 'literally' as they can. They are not considering the definitions of what they have stated, and they are not applied everywhere. There is no reason to suspect that I am not playing competitively. However, rules must be applied equally, or there is not point to having rules...

[Nabterayl]

Since this is the case, the inverse of the rule should be applied to all models taking drones as war gear, for consistency.

I disagree with this. The basic drone rule is "Drones taken as upgrades for a unit act as additional squad members in all regards" (call this A). "Independent Characters who have taken drones as upgrades are still permitted to join units" (call this B) is simply an exception to the basic rule, nothing more. There is no call to infer that B causes an Independent Character to count as a single model, let alone that drones do not count as additional squad members for purposes of Independent Character joining when taken by a non-Independent Character model.

[daboarder]

Honestly cry more guys, please.

This has been part of the rules for 2 editions now. Don't blame others because your unable to read and comprehend.

[Nabterayl]

... who should cry more, the people who think that ICs can join a Riptide unit or the ones who think they can't?

daboarder, I respectfully request that you keep your attitude out of these threads. It does nothing to elevate the quality of this forum for your arguments to be unclear and mixed with belittling attacks.

[daboarder]

... who should cry more, the people who think that ICs can join a Riptide unit or the ones who think they can't?

daboarder, I respectfully request that you keep your attitude out of these threads. It does nothing to elevate the quality of this forum for your arguments to be unclear and mixed with belittling attacks.

Those who cant read the following lines...

Independent Characters can join other units. They cannot, however,
join vehicle squadrons (see page 77) or units that always consist of a
single model

Drones taken as upgrades for a unit act as additional squad members in all regards

so It would be nice if they'd back up their rediculous and nebulous claims of "spirit" with actual quotes.

Because the rules are crystal clear.

[Magpie]

I agree that there does seem to be some inconsistency, particularly since the drones can sort of drift off to be a unit on their own or end up attached to a different unit entirely and make just the Riptide count for the kill point.

But I don't see it as an issue because:

The Drones are pretty clearly NOT wargear, they have their own stat line and they are Jet Pack Infantry (Drone) unit type.

An IC that is already "attached to a unit" can't then attach to another unit, but the IC's with their own drones are a specific exception to this, it's not so much that they don't count but rather they have a special allowance made for them.

The Riptide is very much like Mordrak and his Ghost Knights, they can't join other units but IC's can join them, even if you take Mordrak without an Ghost Knights because some could turn up later on.

[daboarder]

to be honest it doesn't really matter if they are wargear not.

If people want to split hairs like that its pretty hard to argue that drones aren't "models" as such that fact alone unlocks the ability for Riptides to have IC's joined to them.