Illic fun

[daboarder]

still unlikely as his particular rule is non-transferable. it only ever states that "he" may ignore the restriction.

[Bitrider]

Doesn't really matter if normally is there or not, actually. The point is, the IC isn't part of the squad to grant Infiltrate until it's too late to actually Infiltrate. The IC doesn't join the squad until after they've been placed on the board, and since the IC isn't part of the squad yet the squad doesn't have Infiltrate to be held back and deployed later with the IC to get Infiltrate. Cart before the horse.

DL is correct here.

"Being deployed in unit coherency" does not mean one unit must be deployed then deploy your independent character. they are deployed simultaneously and in unit coherency.

DrWobbles logic is flawed here.

[DrWobbles]

@link: Do you deploy your ICs after all your other units have been deployed? no, you deploy them simultaneously with the unit they have joined before the game begins.

NOWHERE does it say a unit must be deployed first and only then can an IC join them.

@bitrider: You need to show me why i'm wrong rather than stating a baseless opinion.

[rle68]

had the issue come up today and the eldar player went bat crap crazy when he tried to infiltrate illic on my wolves and i told him he couldnt.. he grabbed his codex and was screaming when i said i knew what his abilities were but chooser of the slain prevents infiltration within 18" of the marker.. denying a large section of where he wanted to infiltrate...

[DarkLink]

@link: Do you deploy your ICs after all your other units have been deployed? no, you deploy them simultaneously with the unit they have joined before the game begins.

You're misunderstanding. Step by step:

Start deployment, no one is deployed yet, no ICs are attached yet.

Deploy non-infiltrators, and declare reserves. Your IC isn't attached to a squad yet, so no one gets infiltrate. You have to deploy all non-infiltrators/reserves, forcing you to deploy the squad which hasn't received infiltrate yet because the IC hasn't joined them yet.

Move on to deploying infiltrators, once . Your infiltrating IC isn't attached yet, and thus doesn't grant the squad infiltrate yet, meaning you had to have already deployed the squad because they don't have infiltrate. Since the squad is already deployed without infiltrate, and you can't redeploy units,



The squad doesn't get infiltrate until after it's physically on the board. Because you can't hold back on deploying the squad to the infiltration deployment phase, you're forced to deploy the squad during regular deployment because they don't have infiltrate until after they've been placed. You can chose to deploy the IC at the same time, place him in coherency, and attach him to the squad, but then you're wasting infiltrate. Or you can hold the IC back to the infiltration deployment phase, but at that point he's left the squad behind and again the rule goes to waste.


To put it even more simply, the squad can't get infiltrate until after being placed, but the infiltration deployment rules require you to have infiltrate before you place the models in order to actually infiltrate.





Now, you can fudge the rules a little bit to allow the IC to grant infiltrate before joining a squad, just don't pretend that that is the way the rules work.

[Warpspider89]

Bizarrely, you could probably use Eldrad and Illic; deploy Illic with any unit and then infiltrate them (outside 12"-18") when using Eldrad's re-deploy ability.

Interesting proposition! I'll look this up when I get back home.

[DarkLink]

That's actually pretty funny. Eldrad's rule does prevent even infiltrators from going outside your deployment zone, though.

[Warpspider89]

That's actually pretty funny. Eldrad's rule does prevent even infiltrators from going outside your deployment zone, though.

First thing I looked up when I got home haha sadface at infiltrate basically being useless.

[DrWobbles]

Now, you can fudge the rules a little bit to allow the IC to grant infiltrate before joining a squad, just don't pretend that that is the way the rules work.

You are confused. Sometime during your gaming you decided there was a an extra step in deployment when you attach characters to units. There is not.

ICs can begin the game with a unit. This game begins when you decide on a point cost and start selecting your forces. You're confusing the mechanic to show an IC is attached to a unit as some cart/horse/donkey step process. there is no process other than deploying in your deployment zone, deploying infiltrators (including units with IC infiltrators), and redeploying scouts.

ICs are not joining units during deployment, they begin the game that way. This is not a movement phase.

[daboarder]

Alright rules time:

An Independent Character can begin the game already with a unit,
either by being deployed in unit coherency with it or, if the unit is in
reserve) by informing your opponent of which unit it has joined.

This says we begin by "deploying" with a unit so we go see what the deployment rules say.

The sequence for Infiltrators and Scouts is the same in all
Eternal War missions. First, both players deploy their forces
(apart from any units left kept as Reserves or that chose to use
their Infiltrate special rule).

Given the wording as transferable and the fact that deployment refers to the broad "subphase" of the game, not just the placement of units on the board, its pretty clear what is intended by GW.

The IC begins the game with the unit, as such during "deployment" the unit has the infiltrate special rule and is therefore eligible to use it.