Top 3 MOST annoying things in WH40K rules?

[Denzark]

Other players whining about tiny things little things that can easily be house-ruled are probably the most annoying thing about WH40K, the other two, hmmm, narrative gaming is encouraged but no rulebook support (yet) for games masters and the like and I'd say for third I'd say fortifications being placed before terrain limits the usefulness of the bigger pieces if you're not using the narrative method of placing terrain

This is quite short-sighted. 'House' implies you play at the same place and thus can make a common sense ruling based on the majority opinion, shared experience, etc.

That shared experience is missing if you play at different clubs or tournaments etc, and as such house-ruling is not likely or good.

[SaveModifier]

This is quite short-sighted. 'House' implies you play at the same place and thus can make a common sense ruling based on the majority opinion, shared experience, etc.

That shared experience is missing if you play at different clubs or tournaments etc, and as such house-ruling is not likely or good.

The game is meant to have some flexability to allow you and your opponent to enjoy it, and ha done since Rogue Trader and before then when you look at the heritage of the game, if you're not enjoying the game as it is, then you can change the rules so that you do, if you aren't able to change the rules and you're still getting annoyed at the game, then that begs the question of why you're playing in the first place?

[magickbk]

The game is meant to have some flexability to allow you and your opponent to enjoy it, and ha done since Rogue Trader and before then when you look at the heritage of the game, if you're not enjoying the game as it is, then you can change the rules so that you do, if you aren't able to change the rules and you're still getting annoyed at the game, then that begs the question of why you're playing in the first place?

What Denzark was referring to is people like me, the hobby hobo. My schedule doesn't allow me to make a consistent gaming night anywhere, so I have a tendency to show up at a store with an army on a gaming night, play a game or two, and then when I have another night off, do the same at some other store. Having one set of rules, no house rules, means that I can go anywhere with my army and get a game in, even if I don't speak the same language as my opponent. With house rules, I may roll up a unit to something, go to use some ability, and my opponent goes "we don't play that way here, we have a house rule against it."

[DarkLink]

Snap Firing at Flyers. Skyfire is too rare, and GW seems utterly incapable of balancing their Flyers. With the exception of the Storm Raven, which is pretty well priced for its abilities, Flyers are either way, way too good (Heldrake), or terrible (DA Flyers).

What I said still works though. If you where 6 inchs from making it in to assault and lose your front guy or two making it 8 inches then role a 7 you have still failed to make the charge because of the deaths caused by over watch.

People are like "oh, but assault is better because you can charge further". Those people are stupid.

You can charge further, but you also now have roughly a 30% chance of failing a 6" charge. You can take casualties on the way in, particularly against Tau, one of the few armies who's major weakness is assault, and those casualties turn your 6" charge into a 7-8" charge, bumping your odds of failure up to over 50%. It's more difficult to assault through terrain, and Disordered Charge is a huge nerf in and of itself. All so you can, what, charge an extra inch on average?

To be competitive, you must be reliable. Assault is not reliable, and it received multiple nerfs, so it's weaker, and it shows. The only reason it is still a major part of the game is that certain units are so ridiculous, like flying Daemon Princes, that they're effectively impossible to shoot to death and turn the game into herohammer. Otherwise, assault is a major afterthough to shooting, even if it is a useful one.

Not being able to use krak grenades in close combat...

Ummmm.....

The game is meant to have some flexability to allow you and your opponent to enjoy it, and ha done since Rogue Trader and before then when you look at the heritage of the game, if you're not enjoying the game as it is, then you can change the rules so that you do, if you aren't able to change the rules and you're still getting annoyed at the game, then that begs the question of why you're playing in the first place?

You're missing the point. If you just random show up and grab a pickup game with someone you don't know, which happens all the time if you don't just play in your mom's garage with a couple of friends, they will just give you a weird look and find someone else to play if you hand them a sheet and say 'by the way, I've modified the core rules because I think these things are broken'. House rules are not, and cannot be, and effective solution to this problem for a very large portion of the 40k community.

[Cleon]

1 - Look out sir. Artificer armour wearing bike captains being able to take every AP3 or worse hit and then pass off the AP2s on a 2+ gets old, fast.

2 - Snap firing Tesla. Really you got a hit and now it's 3 hits Ok during normal shooting, but on over watch it really hurts.

3 - Power Axes. Really Dante swings at the same time as power fists? how did he live so long?

[confoo22]

1. You should be able to assault when walking on from reserves. I can understand not being able to when you deep strike since you might be disoriented or de-harnessing yourself or whatever, but if you walk on I don't understand why you wouldn't able to assault.

2. Jet pack units. The ability to jump-shoot-jump at full BS is a little op imo. They should make it that if they want to jump after shooting they can only fire snap shots.

3. And because this particular dead horse hasn't been beat enough... Heldrake, Heldrake, Heldrake.

[ajefferism]

Having a 2+ armour/cover/invul save model in front all the other 20+ models in his unit, yet somehow all the bullets magnetically go to him first.... lame. Suspension of disbelief, destroyed.

[Jim Christensen]

1:Just Space marines

2:Blood Angels

3:...And uhm Space marines.

[wbravenboer]

My personal issues
1. Gauss auto-glancing, and glancing hits in general, enough hits, and vehicle wrecked.
2. Necron Scythes
3. Some codexes have too few troop choices, I would like too see a bit more variation, Eldar have a nice selection for instance.

[Archon]

1. And They Shall Know No Rules: ATSKNF is way too good. It ignores so much of the morale game that most morale effects are generally ignored. Immune to Fear, ok, fluffy. Auto-regroup and consolodate. OK, not bad. May move and fire like normal after the auto-regroup and consolodate while everyone else has to stand around and snapshoot? Not cool.
To make it less overpowered, I would remove the "may move normally" bit out. You get the 3" consolodate like everyone, and can shoot or charge normally, but you don't get to move 6" on top of the free 3" consolodate.

2. Vehicle speed bands. Snapshots help some, but shooty tanks are still rather immobile. Vehicles are more vulnerable now, let them have some teeth back. Make combat speed 6" and may fire all weapons, cruising speed 12" and fire 1 plus snapshoot the others. And let troops assault after disembarking if it did not move that turn. Instead of fast vehicles affecting weapons, make fast give an extra 6" if you go flat out.

3. Assaulting vehicles. Make it less of a gimme. Stationary vehicles hit automatically. Combat speed hit on a 3+. Cruising speed hit on a 4+, flat out on a 5+.

This - I totally agree, couldn´t have write it better. ATSKNF is this arkward rule, when a marine with normal chapter-tactics, failed his leadership because he want to be closer, in his next turn ... - thats ugly.

Snap Firing at Flyers. Skyfire is too rare, and GW seems utterly incapable of balancing their Flyers. With the exception of the Storm Raven, which is pretty well priced for its abilities, Flyers are either way, way too good (Heldrake), or terrible (DA Flyers).

Yes HD is a bit over and yes DAs Flyers a bit under but the Storm Raven is a bit underpriced, because:

12 allaround - a flying fortess
shooty as hell(drake) on two targets (i see them usually with assault cannons and multimelta) and can reach almost every unit it wants
can shoot a lot, even if jinked, thanks to twinlinked weapons
can bear a lot of assault-nastyness in it belly