C'tan charging through difficult terrain

[Kyban]

I have a quick question about the FAQ and the C'tan shards charging through difficult terrain. The core FAQ says:

Q: Do models that ignore difficult terrain when moving or
charging still fight at Initiative step 1 if they charge through
difficult terrain? (p22)
A: Yes.

However, the C'tan shard's Immune to Natural Law ability says:

C'tan Shards ignore the effects of difficult and dangerous terrain while moving.

I tend to use RAW as much as possible since it's the only way to actually get a solid answer which makes me think they stay at initiative. The init reduction is an effect of difficult terrain and the Shards ignore the effects rather than the terrain. Of course, that could just be nitpicking, and I personally believe that FAQ ruling is pretty dumb anyway. What do you guys think?

[Nabterayl]

I am inclined to think C'tan shards would not be slowed by charging through Difficult Terrain, actually. Consider the FAQ in light of, say, the general rule for beasts, which says "not slowed by difficult terrain (even when charging)." "Ignore the effects of" does not seem to me to be the same sort of thing as "not slowed by" (and honestly, I think the RAW answer to whether a beast is reduced to I1 when charging through DT is pretty clearly yes, even without the FAQ).

[Ben_S]

If I understand you right, you think RAW means they ignore not only movement penalties but also the Initiative-reducing effect. That doesn't seem clearly right. If you want to go by RAW note that it says they ignore the effects *while moving*.

Once fighting, they are no longer moving and there's nothing in the RAW to say they ignore the effects then - so they still strike at Initiative 1 it seems.

[Nabterayl]

note that it says they ignore the effects *while moving*.

Once fighting, they are no longer moving and there's nothing in the RAW to say they ignore the effects then - so they still strike at Initiative 1 it seems.

That is a fair point. Unless somebody has a counter-point, I'm swayed to this point of view.

[dirkspair]

well, since one power the C'tan can take grants him "assault grenades" i would think without them he would be effected by the I reducing effects of charging through cover. would be a bit redundant otherwise.

[Kyban]

well, since one power the C'tan can take grants him "assault grenades" i would think without them he would be effected by the I reducing effects of charging through cover. would be a bit redundant otherwise.

Well, a redundant rule wouldn't exactly be a first, though they could still throw the assault grenades.

Good point though Ben, consider me swayed as well. Probably would've played it that way anyway, just to be safe.

[Chris*ta]

I really think the "while moving" is absolutely definitive. Attacks don't happen while moving, ergo, the C'Tan goes at I 1.

And as for the argument that they could throw the Assault grenades, the Necron Codex was written under 5th Ed, wasn't it?

[Mr Mystery]

well, since one power the C'tan can take grants him "assault grenades" i would think without them he would be effected by the I reducing effects of charging through cover. would be a bit redundant otherwise.

This.

[Tynskel]

I really think the "while moving" is absolutely definitive. Attacks don't happen while moving, ergo, the C'Tan goes at I 1.

And as for the argument that they could throw the Assault grenades, the Necron Codex was written under 5th Ed, wasn't it?

Yes. 5th Edition rules should be compared to 6th.
It is possible that 6th changed the way 'moving through cover' works, and thus invalidating an older rule (the ability to buy assault grenades).

This has happened before. Most notoriously, Tyranids: the Carnifex lost half of its options when 5th Edition hit.

[Lord Krungharr]

The C'tan Shard, being a Monstrous Creature, has Move Thru Cover per 6th edition MC rules. That means it ignores Dangerous Terrain tests (that's why Flying Greater Daemons/Princes can move and deepstrike into terrain with no Dangerous test).

Ignoring the effects of Difficult Terrain would only mean the C'tan doesn't have to roll 2 dice and pick the highest for movement through Terrain like normal Infantry, nor does it have to roll 3D6 and pick the 2 lowest for charge range if moving through Terrain like normal Infantry. (Dangerous already being covered in the Move Thru Cover rule)

Like my Flesh Hounds with no Skull Cannon however, the C'tan Shard would still strike at Initiative 1 in combat if charging through Terrain, unless it has something equivalent to assault grenades (whatever that might be called).

Just make sure you give him that assault lascannony weapon; if only my Jugger Heralds could take that....