Favorite "Secret of the 40k Universe"

[Grumpy Ripper]

That the empeor has been reborn and is the hive mind and his aim to consume his old host body to fully relase his power so the nids can destroy chaos as he engineerd...... What yes its random fan dream but hey


seroiusly i think its that garvil loken was one of the 1st grey knights.

[jcflanker]

That the empeor has been reborn and is the hive mind and his aim to consume his old host body to fully relase his power so the nids can destroy chaos as he engineerd...... What yes its random fan dream but hey


seroiusly i think its that garvil loken was one of the 1st grey knights.

I thought Loken was killed by Abbadon

[ThePov]

I thought Loken was killed by Abbadon

He was killed, on Istvaan III, if I recall correctly. I think it was Qruze who got away, which is a shame, because he's kind of a crochety old man, where as Loken was a total BA.

[jcflanker]

He was killed, on Istvaan III, if I recall correctly. I think it was Qruze who got away, which is a shame, because he's kind of a crochety old man, where as Loken was a total BA.

i pulled this from lexicanum about Loken however i don't remember reading this.

[url]http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Garviel_Loken[/url]

"Although we are lead to believe that Loken perished in the final bombardment of Isstvan III, there has never been any factual statement either way supporting his unfortunate demise or his survival of a second bombardment as the last we know of him he was trapped under a layer of rubble as a Titan broke one of the walls of the building they were in. "

[Tyrsday]

Malal is one of my favorites too. They somewhat, sort of, bit of a stretch, reference him in the new Chaos Marines codex with the Sons of Malice on one of the rogue gallery pages who have his color scheme: quartered white and black.

If the Alpha Legion were to serve any of the Chaos gods, he is the one I could most see them worship.

[firestorm]

This is one of the best threads about 40k Background I've ever read, well done to all the contributors.

With regards to Prometheus' points about the Tau and the Tyranids and the Ad Mech, I think miteyheroes' responses kind of clear those up.

Having said that, there still remains the issues that the Deceiver and the Laughing God ARE the same being, in which case the Harlequins are controlled by the C'tan.

I think the problem with this is that there are references in certain fluff that the Eldar know of the C'tan (through the war on heaven) and are opposed to their ressurection and the Necrons. So for me it doesn't totally add up that the C'tan control the Eldar - though we are talking about the Deceiver possibly...

Although it's not plausible The Outcast IS the Hive Mind, I think there's the plausible scenario that the Necrons/C'tan created the Tyranids - a lot of Necron fluff has it that they went in to their hibernation partly because a 'plague' was consuming the galaxy. I think that this plague WAS the Tyranids, created by the Necrons to defeat the races of the Old Ones, and after consuming the galaxy they drifted off, now millions of years later they've returned now the galaxy is teeming with life.

I'm aware that there's problems with this: why would the Null-psyker C'tan/Necrons create a psyker-ked race? And they hate ALL life, surely they'd hate the 'Nids too... I used to interpret it that the Old Ones, almost extinct and losig against the Necrons/C'tan, created the Tyranids as a desperate last attempt to fight their nemises... But, again, why then would the Hive Fleets avoid Necron Tomb worlds?

Finally, with regards to Xenology and the Necrons, I suppose it is plausible that the whole set up was to fill the INquisitor with false info and lies; the way I always interpreted the ending was that the Necron had been using the Inquisitor's studies in order to find out about the various races of the galaxy - after all at the end it says 'know thine enemy, for you are already known to him...'


With regards to the true nature of the Emperor, the whole 'theology', real-nature of the 40k deities has always been a real interest of mine. I like the portrayal in False Gods that Horus sees a vision of a giant, golden being.

Now, although it has been very plausibly put forward here by several that the Emperor IS an Old One, my way of interpreting it was that the Emperor was not literally this alien or divine being, but rather a manifestation of the psychic (divine?) consciousness that created and guided humanity. Hence you get Saints etc in the 40k background, who are similarly individuals possessed (for want of a better word) by this consciousness (to a far lesser degree than the Emperor) enough to lead humans, when neccessary, through difficulat and dark instances.

And, similarly, I've held that it is the same for the other races - the Eldar have their gods which are the 'overseers' of their race, and are able to call upon their psychic/'divine' spirit/form/whatever when creating their Avatars...

Then you've got Gork and Mork...

I think that this could fit in with the Old Ones, as they created these and other races, my interpretation is that they created remarkable, god-like protoforms of these races, that are the beings held as the 'gods' of their races.

So powerful were these beings that their abilities went beyond their physical forms, so they eventually existed in the immaterium, from where they have intvervened and over-seen their 'children' races.

To be honest, I see the flaws in this - e.g. why didn't the Eldar gods intervene to prevent their fall? - and it's probably not as plausible as the Emperor simply being an Old One.

But this idea of their being a 'presence', 'spirit', psychic consciousness or whatever from these 'gods' that can still inhabit individuals (e.g. Sebastian Thor, Celestine, Gazghull Thraka, etc) and through them lead their races to greatness.

[Grumpy Ripper]

I thought Loken was killed by Abbadon

He left buried under a wall. Also in a interview i forget with who, said they plan to do more stories with gravil.

the way i think he survives is rylonor (sp) the EC dread that was guarding the underground hanger comes and saves him before hes blown up, or finds him after a partial and not througher bombardment.

[Duke]

This thread has gotten out of control in an awesome way! great job to all the contributors.

If the 40k Universe progressed, what direction would it take? Based on all the 'secrets,' we have discussed.

Duke

[Dark_Templar]

This thread has gotten out of control in an awesome way! great job to all the contributors.

If the 40k Universe progressed, what direction would it take? Based on all the 'secrets,' we have discussed.

Duke

Tyranids win. The end.

[ThePov]

This thread has gotten out of control in an awesome way! great job to all the contributors.

If the 40k Universe progressed, what direction would it take? Based on all the 'secrets,' we have discussed.

Duke

It won't. I wrote a long post on it in another thread, but basically, the 40K universe is set up so that it doesn't need to move forward, and thus it won't. It's already so vast that it has a functionally inexhaustable supply of secrets to uncover and wars to fight.

That said, logically, the mythology currently suggests that this is the end of the Age of the Imperium. It won't go without a fight, obviously, and there would likely be a ctalclysmic battle, the specifics of which vary depending on which of the many Doomsday theories you subscribe to (War in Heaven, Tyranids, Orks, Massive Chaos Incursion, all of the above, other), but it is without doubt that the Imperium as we know it would collapse and galactic anarchy would reign for a time.

(This is where a good knowledge of history, sociology, literature, and mythology come in handy, fun declarations like that)