Islands of Blood? and getting started

[xbenblasterx]

Like many people on the forum i'm currently an avid 40k player grey knights in fact i do love me some knights in space!, however i cant help but peek over the hedge at other systems fro my next project, I'm preety resolute about not wandering beyond Games Workshops systems as i,m mainly in the hobby fore lore and background something which i believe GW come second to none' although i cant tink of another system that produces such high quality products either!..... even if the cost is premium,

enough waffle! My question is i have no idea where to start, in Fantasy Skaven quite appeal to so i was considering the Islnds of blood box?

Is it a good place to start? Although i cant help but look to either the Ogres or Orcs and Goblins, hel me mae up my mind bols! some opions on the different armies would be great!

[Wildeybeast]

Island of Blood is a good starting point as you get plenty of models for a good price. You can make it even cheaper if you can find a friend to go halves with you. You also get the mini rule book in there as well. If you just want the models you can often find them for sale on eBay as people get rid of the half of that set they don't want. A word of caution though. IoB is a goo starting point, but that's all it is. You can't actually make a legal army out of the stuff on there. You will need to add more units and obviously an army book.

In terms of the armies, both ogres and orcs have 8th ed books and are pretty competitive. Orcs are very much a horde army and ogres are the opposite. With them it's all about small numbers of elite troops. Orcs are great fun to play, but somewhat unpredictable. Skaven are currently very powerful, being an old book.

[Baneblade]

The obvious place to start is with the rulebook and the Army Book of your chosen army, like in 40k.

Here are some basics that really differentiate WFB from 40k:

1) Unit facing is very important. Units do not have a 360 degree line of sight and can only see in a 45 degree arch in front of them. This is key for charging, which is done at the beginning of the turn as opposed to 40k where you can move then charge. In addition to units can only see in front of them, that also makes charging the flack or rear very beneficial to the charger as it adds bonuses to combat resolution.

2) Unit sizes are massive for many armies. This is true for O&G and Skaven. It is not uncommon to see units of 50 or more. An army can easily have 100+ model count. Skaven can hit 200+ with room left over for the crazy toys they have.

3) Weapons and Armor are pretty standard across most armies, with a few exceptions. Heavy armor is the same on an orc, man, knight, or an ogre. Armor also stacks, so a model with heavy armor has a 5+ save, but give him a shield it becomes 4+ save, then putting him on a horse makes a 3+ save and so forth. How to deal with armor is very different from 40k. Weapons do not have an AP value, but the model's strength (after weapon modifications) will reduce the armor value. Using my previous example of the 3+ save model here is how armor reductions work. If a model wounds the knight with a 3+ save by a model with a hand weapon (no S modifications) at S 3, there is no modifications. However change that hand weapon to a great weapon (+2 S and always strikes last), then that knight would suffer a -2 to his save which would bring it to a 5+ save. Any attacks at S 4 or higher reduces the armor save by 1 point. S 4= -1 S5=-2 and so forth.

3) Magic is powerful. Pyskers in 40k cast powers for the most part independent of each other. They do not share a pool which they draw all their power from, unlike WFB. In WFB all magic is done in a single phase, and the ability to cast spells is drawn from a generated pool of dice. Magic is not simply a leadership test. More powerful spells are more difficult to cast and have a high casting value. The caster uses dice from the power pool to attempt to cast the spells. The opposing player can attempt to stop the spell by using dice from his dispel pool of dice. No simple Deny the Witch roll. The two wizards are magically battling, and whomever rolls better wins the duel to see if the spell is cast or dispelled.

4) Army selection is no longer a force org chart. It is percentage based off of the size of the game played. You will need a min of 25% of your army to be from the Core, while up to 25% can be a Lord, Hero, or Rare and 50% can be Special.

Those cover the key differences without going into great detail. Now on to the armies that you have named your interest in.

Skaven is a horde army that is very random. For the most part your basic rank and file models are weak, but there are a lot of them. They also have very poor leadership values, but share a rule to 40k Orks to boost their LD. Their strength is in their numbers, so while they may not deliver a knock out punch in combat it can be very difficult to have them run. This creates a very effective road stop that allows their toys to do their work. While the rank and file will not win the battle for you, Skaven toys can wreak havoc. Hell Pit Abominations are very strong and hard to kill. Warp Lighting Cannons can be one of the most powerful war machine in the game. However all the big scary things in the Skaven list is random. you can easily have a game where you are unstoppable and killing everything in your path without breaking a sweat, and in the next game you cannot kill your way out of a wet paper bag if your dice rolls are poor. Consistency is not the Skaven way of play, so be prepared for not having everything go according to plan in both good and bad ways.

Orcs and Goblins was my first army. Much like the Skaven, they are a horde army with a flair of randomness. Win or lose the odds are something in your army did something that made you laugh. O&G is also the most diverse army in the game, with more choices in the book than you can shake a squig at. Orcs are not that all different from Orks in 40k. They are your blunt tools. Big, mean, and tough. There are three main types of orcs. Common orcs are like their 40k counterparts and simple. Savage orcs are the pretty funny. They are naked except for their war tattoos that protect them. They are also frenzied, so they get more attacks than the common orc at the cost of sometimes charging things that you do not want them to. The last group of orcs are the black orcs. These guys are the no nonsense kind of orcs. The most heavily armed of orc. Remarkably well disciplined for the army since they do not have to test for animosity, like the rest of the army. Goblins on the other hand are weedy and require a more cunning hand to use. They are not powerful fighters or are very tough, but they are sneaky. Night goblins are one of my favorite units in the book. They are only LD5 but they have an ace up their sleeve that can give pause to many opponents. The fanatics. Fanatics are hidden in the unit and are only reveled when the enemy gets close enough, then a whirling ball of death and destruction is released on the battle. There are only a few things that don't fear the fanatic due to their large number of powerful hits they do as they pass through units. They cannot be killed in normal ways and will randomly go around the battle ground. Sometimes they will swing back in your own battle line and inflict heavy damage to your own army. All of it is hilarious. O&G do not get along with each other. Other than black orcs, most everything in the book must test for animosity. This can have units charging off at the closest thing they see, squabble and do nothing, or pick fights with your own units. The first time I use my O&G army, I had 2 units of goblins throw dung at each other for two turns while the rest of my army marched forward to combat. Win or lose there will always be funny moments with O&G.

Ogres are sledgehammers. Unlike the other two armies Ogres is the smallest model count in the game. An entire army can have less than 40 models. Lightly armored, but hit with a ton of bricks. Everything is very direct with ogres. Not as random as O&G or Skaven, but very brutal army. They have access to a lot of large monsters, and everything is big for them.

[Mr Mystery]

Base of the game is different from 40k as well, in that it's not about taking and holding objectives for the most part, but driving your foe from the field. Which is easier said than done.

In Warhammer, you don't get half measures these days. If I've mauled an enemy unit all game, and it finishes the game with a single survivor, I get nothing from that unit (barring a banner. Yay stealing banners!).You have to finish off the enemy unit (catching it with a pursuit move, wiping it out with shooting or combat, or chasing it off the board) to get your VPs.

This is quite oddly the greatest balancing factor in the game. Some people like to Deathstar, which is to pile all your ming, and a hefty chunk of points into a disgustingly hard unit, with the aim of utterly annihilating anything it charges, and in many instances, anything that charges it. This isn't necessarily unsporting. Why? Because it means you'll have skimped on the rest of your force, and if as your opponent I'm clever enough, I can prevent that Deathstar unit from ever truly punching it's weight, whilst nipping up round it's flanks to take out the rest of your army.

This is the opposite of Multiple Small Units, where you depend on a wide spread of units to get as many attacks in as possible. This isn't terribly common these days, as small units of infantry don't tend to do very much.....

For me, the art of Warhammer is knowing when to pin an enemy unit and take my licks, and when to crush an enemy unit. You can tell this is a solid approach because so many people whine and whine and whine about Skavenslave Tarpit units (dirt cheap, last forever, and with a bit of care, don't often run away). Though precisely why they are charging the cream of their army into a unit well known to be the best chaff on offer (ridiculously low points, don't run away etc) is a total mystery to me!