"Smash" rule and Smash Attacks

[Tynskel]

Yeah, I'm sure that GW's sitting there with their pocket protectors and calculators thinking 'but how does the energy wave propagate through ceramite? What if we run a finite element analysis to find the weak points in power armor to justify Rending?"

I don't think they think about it that way with actual calculators. However, I'm sure some of the guys/gals that work there have taken physics at some point in their life.

[John Bower]

Yeah. Exactly my point. They are still alive, not dead.

Only the ones you can ask are, and then only the ones who didn't get a full on hit. Believe me, that tail can (and does) kill. And a croc/alligator is not the size of a double decker bus, or larger of course as in the case of Tyranids that have such an attack, if you want to equate it to something that size, check out Dragons in DnD, whose tail can do a heck of a lot of damage. It doesn't kill because DnD of course is heroic fiction and you can't have the main PC's dying outright because nobody would play, they are considered more or less to have 'eternal warrior' for all intents and purposes. But any creature the size of a Hive Tyrant or larger smacking you down with it's tail will undoubtedly kill you.

[Tynskel]

Only the ones you can ask are, and then only the ones who didn't get a full on hit. Believe me, that tail can (and does) kill. And a croc/alligator is not the size of a double decker bus, or larger of course as in the case of Tyranids that have such an attack, if you want to equate it to something that size, check out Dragons in DnD, whose tail can do a heck of a lot of damage. It doesn't kill because DnD of course is heroic fiction and you can't have the main PC's dying outright because nobody would play, they are considered more or less to have 'eternal warrior' for all intents and purposes. But any creature the size of a Hive Tyrant or larger smacking you down with it's tail will undoubtedly kill you.

Tyrant tail attack-str 6 AP5. Yup. That'll kill just about anything.

[DWest]

Tyrant tail attack-str 6 AP5. Yup. That'll kill just about anything.

That's exactly the problem though- it has a reasonable AP to go along with the high S. It's the attack with S8 and AP- that makes no sense. How can you hit something hard enough to inflict the damage equivalent to a krak missile and have it bounce off even the lightest armor?

[Wolfshade]

A lot depends on how the force is deployed.

Usain Bolt when running full tilt is more energetic than a speeding bullet (obviously depending on bullet type etc.) but if he hits you, you would not expect to die, it is possible, you could crack your head on the floor badly, but it is remote. High strenght low ap. Then a bullet less, powerful, could kill you relatively easily because it is designed to penetrate.

[Katharon]

That's exactly the problem though- it has a reasonable AP to go along with the high S. It's the attack with S8 and AP- that makes no sense. How can you hit something hard enough to inflict the damage equivalent to a krak missile and have it bounce off even the lightest armor?

Ever seen a deer get hit by a car going 60 and walk away like nothing happened? Or the parachutist who fell two miles to the ground, landed on a bush and only had slight scrapes and bruises? Or the 8-month old Chinese baby that was stabbed in the face 90 times with a pair of scissors and survived just fine (with 90 stitches admittedly)? Stuff just happens in the right way and things don't get hurt (much).

[DWest]

I would put that under 'rolling a 1 to wound'. Personally, I'd like to see the macetail be S8 AP4- basically a giant power maul.

[Tynskel]

That's exactly the problem though- it has a reasonable AP to go along with the high S. It's the attack with S8 and AP- that makes no sense. How can you hit something hard enough to inflict the damage equivalent to a krak missile and have it bounce off even the lightest armor?

I already answered this:
[url]http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?41040-quot-Smash-quot-rule-and-Smash-Attacks&p=389410&viewfull=1#post389410[/url]

[Tynskel]

Ever seen a deer get hit by a car going 60 and walk away like nothing happened? Or the parachutist who fell two miles to the ground, landed on a bush and only had slight scrapes and bruises? Or the 8-month old Chinese baby that was stabbed in the face 90 times with a pair of scissors and survived just fine (with 90 stitches admittedly)? Stuff just happens in the right way and things don't get hurt (much).

There we go. It is just a giant tail. If you are between a rock and a hard place, that tail squishes you. Otherwise, you just get battered around.

[John Bower]

A lot depends on how the force is deployed.

Usain Bolt when running full tilt is more energetic than a speeding bullet (obviously depending on bullet type etc.) but if he hits you, you would not expect to die, it is possible, you could crack your head on the floor badly, but it is remote. High strenght low ap. Then a bullet less, powerful, could kill you relatively easily because it is designed to penetrate.

That doesn't work, he's a guy doing what? 25 - 30 mph, yet you're saying he'll hit with more force than a bullet doing nearly a thousand? I doubt that. I know a bullet weighs bugger all, but all that force is on the point. and bugger moving at e=mc squared, is still a lot of power when c squared is 1 million X the weight of the bullet. Compared to maybe 12 stone going at 600.