Did we ever have 40K balance issues back in the day?

[Mike Lawler]

2nd edition was a lot of fun IMO as well.. it felt more "interesting"..

That said.. it wasn't balanced at ALL.. I think the big difference is now we have the internet and can:
A) Compare results so that imbalances stick out more
B) Complain in a more focused area blowing things out of proportion or creating a scapegoat reaction rather than a "find another way around" type of mentality.

We were forced IMO to work things out in our personal communities and arrive at concessions on dealing with the imbalances or understanding and dealing with the fact that certain things were just going to wreck shop. I have been out of the loop the last few years but back then it seemed like every year or so an "unbeatable" army would make it's rounds and then just kind of die off. I usually tried to avoid this except that I made a leafblower army before that was really a thing.. and I was running the broken Khorne DP with Wings and Blood Thirster combo when that was really all you needed to field... Which I mostly ran to counter the other DP steam rollers that were frequenting my FLGS back then.

[GrauGeist]

have always been OTT stuff?

No, don't be silly. Everything has always been perfectly balanced, from the day Rogue Trader was released. Then 6E came out and everything fell apart.

We didn't have ridiculous tables of tables back in RT that could cause models to swing from uberawesome (Chaos-favored Exalted Champion) to pure crap (Spawn!), nor people lobbing Vortex Grenades willy-nilly. We didn't have Tyranid tables that affected the entire game board in 2E, nor Psykers running amok. We didn't have Eldar stomping MEQ new buttholes with massed Starcannon in 3E, nor stupid "Iron Warriors" Chaos Marine builds with extra Heavies. Custom VDR wasn't an issue. We didn't have Rhino Rush or Hellturkey or Necron issues. Tyranids were never unbalanced. Orks have always been perfectly competitive.

No, this imbalance thing is totally new and unique to 6E. When "7E" comes out, everything will be returned back to perfect balance.

[Brother Horatio]

I started playing in 3rd edition, so my experience with cheese is limited. Rhino Rush was incredibly lame, and I even played blood angels (I only used 3 tactical squads in Rhinos, the rest of my army was 6 dreadnoughts: back then, Blood Angels were the only ones who could have that many!)

But I think the cheesiest army ever is still the Alaitoc Ranger force, with the Ranger Disruption Table. Why was it the cheesiest? It killed your army before you even deployed, and other than being entirely mechanized (which was fairly rare then, at least in my local gaming community), there was nothing you could do about it. At least not taking your army out of the case before you lost saved your time. And of course, in the "stealthy sniper list," you could always count on seeing 3 Wraithlords and the Avatar...

[sparti67]

Many years ago, I had a conversation with a local U.S. hobby store owner. The topic was on the freedom U.S. consumers demanded and ultimately won (for a time) in relation to GW. We could order any bit directly, and had the ability to create our own vehicles and unique troop choices. Orcs could loot, but most armies had some degree of flexibility too. OP was fine because every army had some loophole they could use to level the playing field. Today the structure of the game has infected the spirit of the game. At times it's like reading a code of conduct policy or the bi-laws at the workplace. Listing all of the "you cant's" and "you must" and "you wills" takes away something that used to be there and made the game much more enjoyable. I hope that our community can find that "something" again where vortex grenades, although "op" ran rampant through the ranks and everyone went mad with laughter. There are days I opine for the return of the swarm lord who ate half your army before the first turn began. Who knows, maybe the ambiguity of rulesets will eventually produce something we all can live with. But then again, maybe I will win the lotto.

[Eldar_Atog]

You'll never find a game that is perfectly balanced. Even chess is not perfectly balanced since the initiative always lays with white.

[Lord Draekor]

Over the years (decades) I've gone from scenario gaming in RT and early/mid 2nd edition to competitive gaming late 2nd edition into 4th edition with 5th being a break and 6th I'm back to scenario gaming and plan to keep it that way. Balance has never been a priority for GW games design. While I foolishly spent time playing competitively successfully I look back on it now wondering what the hell was I taking to think that was a good idea?

You'll never find a game that is perfectly balanced.

Tic-Tac-Toe
Checkers

[Horse]

Well, i played alot of second ed as a 15 year old kid, and thinking back, i have no idea what was and wasn't balanced. I played a game every weekend for about 3 years, sometimes also played at lunchtime at school and i have zero recollection of balance issues. The game was not balanced and thinking about it it now it definitely had serious 'flaws' buy todays internet standards, but none of us cared. At all. We took what we had painted or had available to play with. We never had much regard for the power list or actual characteristics. We made armies out of what we had as poor state school kids building armies from pocket money and birthday presents.

I try to maintain that view now, unfortunately the internet says different. We are spoiled now, we have our higher disposable incomes and access to a world of whinge. I don't think the internet has been overly friendly to our little hobby.

[dirtycrabcakes]

The interwebs ruined balance (and variety)... or at least it ruins balance much faster than was ever possible.

[dirtycrabcakes]

I scratch-built a Baneblade out of cardboard (it looked terrible, but I was proud because I was twelve and lacked better judgement) and fought precisely one battle with it.

After 45 mins of setting up, my Ork opponent (who was a WAAC munchkin who hated me personally - we were 'friends' through geographical proximity and a shared hobby as opposed to anything else) fired a single plasma cannon shot at the thing. Which penetrated the armour, hit the cannon's magazine, and detonated the tank.

The resulting explosion covered my half of the table in a ball of burning death which killed my ENTIRE ARMY.

Total battle time: 3 minutes.

Total time for my opponent to gloat about his 'brilliant win': two years.

Oh... damn... I considered you my best friend too. Sorry about that. I was going to ask you to be my best man at my wedding. Also, my win was epic, so eat it.

[Denzark]

I found an old army list I wrote the other day - it was a handwritten masterpiece with tick box charts to count down the 40 psi points from my Level 4 terminator librarian. There were 3 techmarines on bikes - with missile launchers. There was a Marine Lieutenant Commander and a Lieutenant - remember those guys?

I had also written columns for the wound tables to be rolled upon when the medic got to the guys. D100, oh shugar your leg has given you -2" move and -3WS haha...

But even then I don't remember thinking anything that got put down in front of me was undestroyable. The only game I got upset about was when a chap humped me with marines - I had squats. We were playing with card markers for both armies. I found out he took about 3k to my 1k...