Getting Pressure to Start Eldar Again

[Tyrendian]

I know its an old thread but back to the point. D Mc is right, there is a lot of new stuff in the new codex that improves the Eldar offensive capacity. It took me a while to get over some of the other stuff, like introducing Eldar weapons that kill Eldar more than anyone else. Or bumping up the points cost on things to send them beyond the reach of the average 1500 point game. With holo fields and shield strike for serpents, using the shields defensively is a bit redundant. Especially as 3 glancing hits will wreck you anyway. Blade storm means I am finally considering DA for games. And having worked out the intricacies of Warlock powers I am more on board with them now. I think Falcons are being overlooked for other vehicles and they should not be. Again holo fields, a scatter laser & shuriken cannon presents a lot of fire power from S6 to 8 (Pulse laser) and AP 2 to 5, blade storm still applies to a cannon and laser lock is like twin linked. + 6 man transport, hellooooo! Scorpions. I have been trialing Vyper Serpent combo's, both threatening multiple target dilemma and holo goodness.

It is interesting to see how Banshee Masks are more useful than Mandi Blasters now, I mean what is S3 AP- going to do to anyone? Killing 5 points on your target's initiative however means every one, like storm guardians hit first. But Banshee Masks remain cheaper.

amusingly, the new mandiblasters are mathematically better than the old ones against pretty much anything (bar the two or three models out there with T7 obviously)

[entendre_entendre]

I've had some use with Vypers and there are effectively 2 ways to run them: Cheap dakka and blinged out. Have at least 2 in a squadron.
No frills setup: x2 Shuriken Cannnons
Pimp my Jetbike: x2 Shuriken Cannons, Holofields, Ghostwalk Matrix

Usage: These are fast skirmishing units, do not put them in a position where they will take hits b/c they WILL die. You should have something scary on the board in order to draw fire off these guys, something like Wraith units, Serpents, etc. Note: anything that Ignores Cover (Tau things, Vector Strikes, flamers, etc.) will absolutely end Vypers, so ymmv depending on what your meta is (i.e. what your friends/common opponents play). As for targets, you have enough shots to threaten both hordes and MCs. You can even go light vehicle hunting with those S6 shots.

The simple setup is cheap S6 shots (6 each). Keep your distance, keep moving. Try to avoid being the obvious target.
The upgraded setup is played somewhat differently as it is made to hug cover. The Ghostwalk matrix makes you auto-pass any dangerous tests (MTC) and the Holofields gives you +1 cover save as long as you move. Throw these guys in a ruin, move 1" and enjoy 3+ cover saves all day. However, the upgraded unit cost 25pts more/model over the other option, so they get expensive much more quickly.

For comparison, the cheap squad of 3 Vypers is 180pts, but the pimped out ones are almost 250. Your call if they're worth the extra points.

Side note: IMO, if you're going to give Vypers anything but dual cannons, you're probably better off with a Hornet.

[Charon]

I think Falcons are being overlooked for other vehicles and they should not be. Again holo fields, a scatter laser & shuriken cannon presents a lot of fire power from S6 to 8 (Pulse laser) and AP 2 to 5, blade storm still applies to a cannon and laser lock is like twin linked. + 6 man transport, hellooooo! Scorpions. I have been trialing Vyper Serpent combo's, both threatening multiple target dilemma and holo goodness.

It is interesting to see how Banshee Masks are more useful than Mandi Blasters now, I mean what is S3 AP- going to do to anyone? Killing 5 points on your target's initiative however means every one, like storm guardians hit first. But Banshee Masks remain cheaper.

Falcons are overlooked cause Serpents do exactly the same (TL scattler laser makes serpent shield TL which comes with ignore cover and pinningat S7), are more durable, are in fact CHEAPER (pointwise), have a higher transport capacity and do no use a support slot.

Banshee masks are by no means more useful than mandi blasters. An ini10 autohit with S3 is not bad at all. Coupled with granades and their high initiative they wil strike first most of the time (and have the armor so survive, also they get bonus to cover). Banshee masks on the other hand make most enemys drop to ini1. Ok on paper but on the reality is that your targets are in cover most of the time so your ini also drops to 1 as you have no granades. All summed up scorpions are the better pick if you really want to go melee.

[Dave Mcturk]

busy 'experimenting' with the scorpions 'infiltrate in a serpent' malarky...

reckoning that 6 or 7 scorps with the clawarch is not quite resilient enough; so trying out '9's' this weekend...

but starting to think by dropping the 50 pts on the two clawarches and going to minimum squads of '5' i can go with THREE infiltrating serpents that can be a real threat; and the scorpz are just a nuisance. {i run TLBL serpents}

any feedback welcomed xx