Astra Militarum/Imperial Guard - A Comprehensive Review & Comparison

[Clockwork]

I'm curious how the idea the that each model is an individual psyker is suddenly a valid interpretation when we already have other Brotherhood of Psyker units that are clearly not (Daemons for instance).

I mean the first sentence says all we need to know about power generation should work:

A unit with this special rule counts as a Mastery Level 1 Psyker.

The entire unit is a single psyker. Not made of individual psykers who roll for different powers, just a single psyker. As such they get 1 power and that's it.

Seriously when you have multiple people telling you that your twisting the wording of the rules and reading it wrong, well, you're probably wrong.

EDIT:

Let's put aside rules interpretations for a moment here.

Does anyone really believe that, when writing the codex, GW intended for each individual Wyrdvane Psyker to each have a separate psychic power? Does anyone really think GW actually wants that? If you're being honest with yourself, then the only answer you can put to that question is "No", in which case this whole discussion is immaterial.

Not to mention the asinine levels of book keeping to do something like keeping track of who has what powers and making sure you don't use powers you lose when someone dies or their head pops doesn't really fit with GW's method of rules writing (though Daemons does come close).

[This Dave]

Or for another way to look at it do you say "The United States is a country" or "The United States are a country"? Unless you're from before 1865 you say "is" as it's considered a single entity despite being made up of a bunch of different things. This is the difference between a Brotherhood of Psykers, which is a bunch of models acting as a single Psyker, and a Psyker, which is a single model acting as a single Psyker.

No matter how it's read, anything with the Brotherhood of Psykers rule is treated as a single Psyker and so follows all the rules for that.

[Katharon]

I give up. I still think that my interpretation is far more interesting however.

[Clockwork]

I give up. I still think that my interpretation is far more interesting however.

"Interesting" does not mean "correct" however.

[The Emperor]

Not to mention the asinine levels of book keeping to do something like keeping track of who has what powers and making sure you don't use powers you lose when someone dies or their head pops doesn't really fit with GW's method of rules writing (though Daemons does come close).

Yeah, the bookkeeping and keeping track of which psyker has which power would be ridiculous. And if GW really intended for the Wyrdvane Psykers to each have their own individual power, and be the exception to the usual Brotherhood of Psyker rules, then they damn well would've made that explicit in the rules. They would've outright stated that they were an exception to the rules, that each member of the unit gets his own psychic power, and that it's important to keep track of which psyker has which power, but they did no such thing. The only thing we have that suggests otherwise is one poster who doesn't understand syntax and bases his rules judgments on what he thinks is interesting over what's correct.

[Gleipnir]

Probably better to move to a different topic of discussion. I believe the expression is beating a dead horse.

[Garradh]

I believe the expression is beating a dead horse.

Horse wouldn't last long against a S7 power maul. So here's the question - power mauls or frag bomb launchers? What's your take, friends?

[Gleipnir]

Depends on how you are using your Bullgryns, if you are holding them back as close melee support I prefer the slab shields to provide additional cover to vehicles and command or heavy weapons. Remember when drawing Line of Sight with Vehicles you use the weapon rather than the base to determine LoS.(Important way to negate the penalty of firing thru your own slab shields, since the enemy doesn't draw line of sight to shoot back to your weapons)

If you are going for an assault unit go with all brute shields and mauls and let em thrash charge away, preferably with a Ministorium Priest urging them on with Zealot and War Hymns.

[Learn2Eel]

I know Gleipnir, and I appreciate the criticism. Truly. The only true way to operate as a community is to have open discourse - even if we might like to throw a few nasty words around whilst doing so.

My point about the Special rule, however, is that the only reason why Wyrdvane Psykers do not have "Psyker" special rule is because they already have "Brotherhood of Psykers". I don't know how more clear I can be in trying to make that point...I feel kind of lost.

I'm going to throw a little extra in for those still unclear on the Wyrdvane Psyker issue. The point made that Wyrdvane Psykers don't have the Psyker special rule but only the Brotherhood of Psykers special rule in an attempt to side with the thinking that each individual model gets a power doesn't line up with my Chaos Daemon codex. It quite clearly says Pink Horrors have the Brotherhood of Psykers special rule and not the Psyker special rule. This is the exact same situation here, and aside from a tiny bit of confusion with them being the first unit of that kind in a 6th Edition codex, everyone is clear that Horrors only ever generate the one power.

Wrydvane Psykers would be awesome if every model could generate a psychic power, but that is unfortunately - and most definitely - not the case.

[Katharon]

I still just sad that taking a Tank Commander doesn't make Leman Russ Battle Tanks a Troop Choice (but just one that isn't able to score). But then I suppose the guys at Forgeworld and the writers of IA would throw a fit.