Getting the most out of - Pyrovores.

[Charon]

How to get the most out of your Pyrovores... I like it! Here's some biomass for thought:

First: most 40k players think about nids backwards... multiplicity and damage output are want you want, NOT survivability so much. Strength in numbers is the game. If anybody says, "Well I'll just shoot my melta's at your pyrovores and kill them in one round" then they are forgetting that there are also likely two flyrants, an exocrine and a Trygon also coming their way, too. Just becasue of their "low priority" status, pyrovores will probably out-live a lot of other units in the nid army.

Here is the first issue. Number of bodies doesnt matter anymore to tyranids. Thats why I dont like them in their current iteration. They are described in books as massive amount of fangs and claws who chew their way through the enemy with a few big leaderbeasts to take on the hardest enemy resistance.
How they are currently working? A lot of huge beasts supported by a few small shooting beasts to unlock another huge beast. Currently the Tyranids are a race of a few monstrous creatures fielding sometimes even less creatures than an average space marine army. Imperial guard vastly outnumbers nids when it should be the other way round.
Yes, every shot that is aimed at a pyrovore is not aimed at another big bug. 100% agreed. But every pyrovore squad means also LESS big bugs. (a squad of 3 is another carnifex/harpy/biovore squad..)

Second: I think what hurts the pyrovores the most is its SLOW speed and short range. Sure those heavy flamers are great, but you have to get in range to use them. So pyrovores might be best as defensive interceptor units... midtable support and control against aggressive lists might be the best way to go. If you really really really want to get them across the table and in your opponents face, I think a good option might be trygon tunnels with an aegis com-relay. Its a bit of a crap shoot, but with some luck, you can get a trygon tunnel forward on turn 2 and your squad of pyrovores in the opponents backfield on turn 3. The more Trygons and pyrovore units you have, the better your chances are, but that is quite a heavy investement.

The deal with the first part is: Any unit that is capable of "countercharging" deep into the tyranid deplyment zone probably ignores the flamer and just shoots the pyrovores to pieces.
To the second part: Yes. May work. Heavy investment and if you mess up your reserves the game is basically over. But yes. The question here is more of: If you invest that heavily into this one trick pony, why not pick units that can do the same job cheaper/better?

Last thoughts: Some units are definitely NOT as bad as the internet makes them out to be. Most people's opinions are based on theorycrafting and not on actually playing with a squad of pyrovores. Give em a try (proxy them in if you don't want to pay the steed price) and see what happens. Also remember that using them just once is not a very good statistical sample to determine their actual value. Play a few games and try out different combos to get a more accurate feel for them.

Not. Some units are not that bad. But there are obviously way better choices which make them seem bad (unless all better choices are extremely overpowered which probably not the case with nid units).
The problem with pyrovores is that they come in a unit of its own, have a rather cheap weapon and you still pay a premium price for them.

However I can imagine that they could be uses against orcs to a certain extent. But again as suicide unit. and paying 40 points for a suicide unit is possibly rather unwise.

[daboarder]

That's a fair point. I tend to think of them as quite aggressive units - one to be hurled toward the enemy.

But used defensively, kept out of sight near bigger support bugs, they can pose a nasty surprise should anything non-MEQ attempt to overwhelm the big ones in combat. Quick bit of roasty toasty, and then hurl it into combat. Single Heavy Flamer turned on a tightly bunched unit of Orks for instance can reap a hefty tole.

Again, not what I think anyone could consider a prime choice unit, but there are uses for it.

Or.....pay 10 points and have god knows how many spare to spend somewhere else.

[Mr Mystery]

If you can't be bothered to post in the spirit of the thread, leave the thread.

It may shock you to know that you are not in fact the be all and end all of tactical knowledge in the hobby. You, like all of us, are just yet another mook on the interwebs.

[Wolfshade]

Let's keep it civil.

Yes using convential wisdom the Pyrovore is "sub par" as acknowledged in the OP. However, the purpose of this thread isn't "no internets you are wrong, pyrovores are da bomb" (pun intended) but more is to look at "if you had/wanted to take" a pyrovore how is it best utilised.

[CrimsonTurkey]

I think area denial is the only thing they can really be good at. If you can place an objective so that it really easy to keep the pyrovores out of line of sight on said objective, they could slow down and damage a unit moving in on said objective. Of course, this is very dependent on having the right terrain. I'd probably flame whoever approaches first and then charge, hoping to explode.

[xsquidz]

Don't forget that flamers are now much better vs. open topped vehicles. Just a small boost to pyrovores. Works well with the crones flamer as well.

[Halollet]

Pyrovores are so close to being an okay unit. If there was just some way to make sure they appear out of a trygon's tunnel. 3 heavy flamers appearing in your opponents back field is scary. Even if they do nothing, it would force your opponent to scatter away from the tunnel.

They're so close to being good its frustrating. If they had just one of the following then I think they would be worth taking;
- had torrent.
- were beasts.
- were 25 points per model

But I digress, to use them now... Hmmmm.

One way is to hope for the warlord trait that allows you to infiltrate 3 of your units. That way you can outflank them and threaten the sides of the board.

Another way is the trygon tunnel but for that to work you would need a comms array to make sure they come in after the trygon.

Both ways you're leaving it to chance. Less then 50% chance for either plan to work. I guess you could try to get both ways in the same list which isnt that bad really. If both fail you could kepp them in your back field to intercept the enemy line breaker.

There are just so many restrictions wrapped around these guys... Its so frustrating.

[daboarder]

Mystery, Im not being antagonistic, there is simply no reason, rhyme or logical use for the thing, They are currently that useless and superfluous.

Literally all they do is make it easier for your opponent to kill you own bugs.

[Caitsidhe]

My friend Kerstan is a long time bug player and I don't think I've ever seen him use a Pyrovore, not even a a proxy to test it out. He is a very optimistic guy and if even he won't use them, I have my doubts. Looking at their stats I don't see them as being awful in and of themselves. They suffer because, as others have pointed out, you can get more for less with other choices. That has always been a problem for Games Workshop. They can't seem to put a book together without including 2-3 units which have no effective niche. They are obsolete before they ever see the battlefield based entirely on the other units in the book.

I consider this bad business because it ensures they aren't going to sell many of that model. I thought about this bug long and hard before I responded. Not being a bug player, I can't speak with authority. The only thing I can do is "theoryhammer" on how I would use it. I think if I was forced to use it, either by a limited collection or a specific scenario that demanded it, I would run it more or less how Mr. Mystery is describing, i.e. a nice little deterrent to keep certain troops from engaging other troops. I'm not sure how effective that would be since most MC Bugs are deterrents in and of themselves. They are almost always shot to death.

Ideally, I would love to deliver them the same way I do Obliterators. I would love to be able to deep strike them in to flame the crap out of stuff in cover. Sadly, they took away the Bugs version of a Drop Pod and I don't think the Pyrovore could use it even when they hand it.

[Anggul]

We all know Pyrovores are the worst thing in the game. No-one is suggesting otherwise. They're just suggesting the way in which they can maybe accomplish something. I repeat: No-one is saying they aren't the worst, they're just saying how you might use them if you really were that dead set on it. Not sure how hard that is to understand.

The ways given by OP in his opening paragraph are well known and were said months ago though, bit of a dead horse. There have been plenty of posts across the internet about Pyrovores all saying pretty much exactly the same thing. Let's just leave it alone.