Grey Knights Rumour Roundup

[DarkLink]

Draigo got hit with the nerf bat hard, loosing a point off every stat before W. Fair enough he gain AP2 and +3S, but as he is now, he is hardly unparalleled in CC.

Dude, really? He gained +2 str guarenteed, and he's regularly going to be Str 9. With AP2 at initiative, and still hitting almost everything in the game on 3's save, like, Chapter Masters, he's still easily one of the best combat characters in the game hands down, and he's significantly better in that regard than before. T5 rarely came up, no one cares about bs 6. I guess you don't get fnp against lascannons. Losing The Grand Strategy sucks, and no more precog, but trust me, Draigo is significantly better at what he does.

Being a Lord of War is terrible though. It makes taking him massively prohibitively expensive, that's the real nerf.

[Halollet]

Personally I will really miss Mordrak. I enjoyed the 1st turn DS.

Well, I don't think you need to change your tactics. The strike force is one HQ and one troop. So a GM and some termies can deep strike together on turn one on a 3+. Mordrak seems redundant when you have this option available. The 3+ stinks but at least you can run afterwards so you don't get plasma cannoned to death! Not a bad trade off in my mind.

[daboarder]

Dude, really? He gained +2 str guarenteed, and he's regularly going to be Str 9. With AP2 at initiative, and still hitting almost everything in the game on 3's save, like, Chapter Masters, he's still easily one of the best combat characters in the game hands down, and he's significantly better in that regard than before. T5 rarely came up, no one cares about bs 6. I guess you don't get fnp against lascannons. Losing The Grand Strategy sucks, and no more precog, but trust me, Draigo is significantly better at what he does.

Being a Lord of War is terrible though. It makes taking him massively prohibitively expensive, that's the real nerf.

How does he match up against Abby and Swarmlord these days?

[Valerian]

How does he match up against Abby and Swarmlord these days?

He actually compares quite favorably to Abaddon. Abaddon costs 20 points more, and might have a slight edge, but it's honestly a close call. For every advantage that Abaddon has, Draigo has a counter advantage. It'd all come down to who got the charge, and dice rolls. I'll go take a look at the Swormlord and report back.

Regardless, Draigo is nasty now, and on par with some of the best characters in the entire game.

EDIT: Swarmlord is 40 points more than Draigo, but without Eternal Warrior, Draigo should take him pretty easily. The Titansword with Hammerhand and Force turned on is no joke.

[DarkLink]

Abaddon does about 1.2 wounds per turn to Draigo, Draigo does about 1.1 wounds per turn to Abaddon, assuming neither charged. Abaddon hits first. But if Abaddon, say, rolls a 1 for his Daemon weapon or something, he's probably going to lose the fight.

The Swarmlord no longer forces you to reroll sucessful invulnerable saves, and isn't Eternal Warrior, right? If so, Draigo won't even break stride. Even if the Swarmlord is Eternal Warrior, Draigo still probably wins that fight by a solid margin.

You also never run Draigo alone. He's always got buddies, and those guys tend to be Paladins, and Paladins are hands down the best assault unit in the game. GK Terminators are almost as good, just a lot more fragile. So even if Abaddon was to win the challenge or something, he and his bodyguard will probably still get the crap kicked out of them.

Draigo also beats the Chapter Master, they basically have the same numbers except Draigo strikes at initiative and unlike the Chapter Master he's master crafted, so he hits more and hits first. He'll force weapon Wraithknights and Riptides with ease. Daemon Princes will mostly bounce off of him and get forced weapon'd.

In fact, Abaddon is the only unit I can think of that can go toe to to with Draigo in a challenge and expect to have an advantage. Excluding, I suppose, Mind Shackle Scarabs, but Driago cares not for your puny toys (I always pass the leadership test).

[DarkLink]

Oh, Ghazgul would do pretty well, but only when he's got his 2++ up.

[AmasNagol]

Abaddon does about 1.2 wounds per turn to Draigo, Draigo does about 1.1 wounds per turn to Abaddon, assuming neither charged. Abaddon hits first. But if Abaddon, say, rolls a 1 for his Daemon weapon or something, he's probably going to lose the fight.

The Swarmlord no longer forces you to reroll sucessful invulnerable saves, and isn't Eternal Warrior, right? If so, Draigo won't even break stride. Even if the Swarmlord is Eternal Warrior, Draigo still probably wins that fight by a solid margin.

You also never run Draigo alone. He's always got buddies, and those guys tend to be Paladins, and Paladins are hands down the best assault unit in the game. GK Terminators are almost as good, just a lot more fragile. So even if Abaddon was to win the challenge or something, he and his bodyguard will probably still get the crap kicked out of them.

Draigo also beats the Chapter Master, they basically have the same numbers except Draigo strikes at initiative and unlike the Chapter Master he's master crafted, so he hits more and hits first. He'll force weapon Wraithknights and Riptides with ease. Daemon Princes will mostly bounce off of him and get forced weapon'd.

In fact, Abaddon is the only unit I can think of that can go toe to to with Draigo in a challenge and expect to have an advantage. Excluding, I suppose, Mind Shackle Scarabs, but Driago cares not for your puny toys (I always pass the leadership test).

Chapter Master on Bike is around the same points. Draigo only strikes at initiative for the first turn, on average, due to concussive from the Hammer. And the Bike CM can Hit & Run in and out to get the charge bonus attacks every other turn.

I really like Draigo. He is the perfect character to put in a unit of Grav Centurians, and you will see a lot of that being done, no doubt.

Him plus a unit of 5GKTs with Falchions, a hammer and a Psycannon, a Dreadknight with a Hammer, Teleporter and a pair of ranged weapons plus a Storm Raven is pretty good to sling in to any army in some way or another.

[Halollet]

Despite the blandness and uninteresting codex that this is, I think I'm all raged out. Since I play Tyranids who got shot in the foot, and Guard who got washed out, I seem to sense a pattern of these new codexs.

Before with the Tau and Eldar, I remember the release of the WraithKnight that was pushed as something so much bigger then the riptide! They were going for each new release to be bigger and bolder then the last. I think someone realized that's not a good system to base this game on as the person with the oldest codex would be shat upon.

Balancing all the codexes was something that needed to be done. They got rid of the Taudar battle brothers as a fix for that and all the new releases seem to be stripped down to the basics.

It seems that we're suppose to find the fun and creativity in the different detachments and formations, not a particular unit.

I don't know if this is going to work long term or if 8th will bring back in crazy weirdness, I have no idea. It doesn't look good right now as most people are getting depressed about all their toys being taken away. If GW can survive this time of people loosing interest, then there might be a nice balanced game at the end, but I don't see it yet. At least that's the way I feel about 7th.

Thoughts?

[Erik Setzer]

Being a Lord of War is terrible though. It makes taking him massively prohibitively expensive, that's the real nerf.

Ghazghkull (the Lord of War with no invulnerable save except for one turn out of a game, who costs over 200 points) says "Hi!"

[silashand]

It doesn't look good right now as most people are getting depressed about all their toys being taken away. If GW can survive this time of people loosing interest, then there might be a nice balanced game at the end, but I don't see it yet. At least that's the way I feel about 7th.

Indeed. Though I think 7th overall is fine, the psychic phase is very poorly done and as you say people are getting tired of having toys they've been using taken away because GW is playing the petulant child due to the Chapterhouse loss. I haven't seen any new players since 7th dropped, but I don't know if that's the reason. Most of the folks who I know considered it before just didn't want to pay their prices anymore. I'm sure that's still a factor, but who knows going forward. I have not liked any of the 7th edition books really. Most of them are just bland. GW seems to want people to pay more money for supplemental codices and dataslates to get them some semblance of variety, but at twice the cost just to get what should have been in the base codex anyway? Color me unimpressed.

Besides, am I the only one who hates their new codex layout? No more convenient army list in the back of the book is stupid IMO. Now I have to flip through multiple pages while trying to build an army and figure out what goes where. Maybe some folks like it, but I think it's absolutely horrible. Now just more wasted space to show mediocre photos of their miniatures. Frankly I preferred the artwork from previous editions.