British Politics Thread.

[40kGamer]

My issue with this is that it allows a financial oligarchy to control events from behind a governmental facade. One lesson from history has to be wealth = power.

[Wolfshade]

No, not necessarily. Ghandi wasn't rich yet held major political power. Also the workers uprisings again.

There was some discussion over here about stopping polictal parties private fund raising. So the money for campaigns/elections etc. would only come from the public purse. That way lobbyists/supporters are more remote.

Though most seem to dislike this especially given how many people don't bother to be invovled in polotics.

[Mr Mystery]

1% controlling the majority of the wealth is not necessarily a bad thing. It is only if they are not "benefactors" that the problems occur.

For me the issue isn't that those at the top are fabulously wealthy, but that the wealth doesn't seem to go anywhere.

Some of the richest families have frankly staggering amounts of money - and it just makes me wonder why?

Then of course you get Governments looking to protect the wealth of the rich with favourable taxes - not for political favours, but a country does need rich people knocking about. Drive them off, and it will harm the economy.

[40kGamer]

No, not necessarily. Ghandi wasn't rich yet held major political power. Also the workers uprisings again.

Individuals like Ghandi, Mandela or King are rare anomalies fueled by extreme situations. They did wield political power but I would still propose that political power is a derivative of financial power… individuals such as these are more exceptions that prove the rule.

There was some discussion over here about stopping political parties private fund raising. So the money for campaigns/elections etc. would only come from the public purse. That way lobbyists/supporters are more remote.

Campaign reform has come up in the US many times but nothing meaningful has ever been accomplished. In fact things could be considered worse than ever after the creation of Super PACs.
[url]https://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/superpacs.php[/url]

Although the UK system is obviously open to abuse as well. No limits on what any one individual can contribute is pretty crazy! (Although the only thing a limit seems to accomplish is that it forces individuals who wish to influence things to contribute indirectly.)

[url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/24/world/global-campaign-finance/[/url]

Though most seem to dislike this especially given how many people don't bother to be invovled in polotics.

A sad fact that the average citizen has so little confidence in the political systems that they feel no need to be involved in any way.

For me the issue isn't that those at the top are fabulously wealthy, but that the wealth doesn't seem to go anywhere.

Some of the richest families have frankly staggering amounts of money - and it just makes me wonder why?

This hits the issue square in the head. Stratifying the sample at the 1% is actually not a telling metric of the problem. The ultra-wealthy hide in the top 0.1% and as you note these families have staggering amounts of wealth. They also have no incentive to share their wealth (really why should they?) and the current state of the world guarantees that they will maintain their position indefinitely.

Then of course you get Governments looking to protect the wealth of the rich with favourable taxes - not for political favours, but a country does need rich people knocking about. Drive them off, and it will harm the economy.

A valid point but allowing these individuals to hoard the world’s wealth also harms the economy and the public. Plus as someone who works with taxes in the US they receive unimaginably favorable treatment.

And how can anyone politically justify that 5 families should control as much wealth as the bottom 20%?

[url]http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/mar/17/oxfam-report-scale-britain-growing-financial-inequality[/url]

Or how about the lifestyles of those with inherited wealth. Wouldn’t it be nice to just be handed the keys to the kingdom, especially when it is obvious that you could never earn the same on merit?

[url]http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304371504577407171675538352[/url]

This sums up how the wealthy feel about the world at large quite nicely.

[Mr Mystery]

Hand on heart, would we be any different?

I know I feel a certain amount of contempt for those who have squandered life's chances - for instance, the oik who sits on the dole and complains that his benefits aren't high enough, can't get a job because of immigrants, yet flunked out of school aged 15 with no qualifications or literacy.

Now ramp my current position up by 1,000 times, especially for self-made persons. Can be hard to keep sight of how close you came to not making it, and losing everything.

And now something more positive....

Heywood and Middleton by election tomorrow. Here's hoping UKIP get the bloody nose they so desperately need. I'm all for political shake up - Scotland's recent vote delivered just that. But I'd really rather it wasn't attributed to lunatics, bigots and swivel-eyed, chinless gits.

[Kirsten]

what we really need to be doing is putting a stop to these far right groups, especially on social media. there is a great page on facebook called 'exposing Britain First' that I recommend people follow and share, they highlight all the nonsensical crap that britain first pushes. it is very important to educate people and get rid of this nonsense.

[Mr Mystery]

Yup.

I really loathe Britain First. Not only do they spout outright lies, but their cynical little marketing campaigns are horrible! 'How many likes for this Solider who served in WWII, and actually, you know, fought against horrible little fascists like us, but we won't tell you that bit eh'

[Kirsten]

exactly, they claim nearly half a million members, many of whom are not actually British (go figure), but in reality they just post innocent looking pictures that people share without realising. that is why it is so important to expose them, make sure everybody you know understands what is actually going on.

[Mr Mystery]

Yup.

It's like the paranoid fantasist that writes (well, wrote. It's apparently very hard to blog from Prison) the Daily Bale.

If he wasn't serious, that site would be hilarious. I mean, this is a scrawny little no-mark stirring up racial prejudice, and claimed 'left wing extremists were plotting to assassinate him because he's a rising star of the right wing'.....

[Wolfshade]

While I may agree with you, unfortunately, the slippery slope argument, means that unless the group is ouotlawed it is hard to do. I find some of the far left movements equally distateful, but for some reason in British politics, the three main parties + the right get the soap box far far far more than any of the left parties. I remember watching a discussion between various left groups and the one spokesman said that this was the first time that anyone from his organisation (or umberalla group) had been interviewed on the beeb.