Chapterhouse VS GW - Assets Frozen Announcement

[Path Walker]

No company has ever rebranded for reasons related to marketing or increasing the image of the brand, nope, its always becauce the brand is tanking, never mind that they're replacing a frankly innacurate name ("Games" doesn't really mean what it did 30 years ago) and a logo from the 80s that, while I love it, is really showing its age in todays highstreet, where design is now more about clean lines and simple fonts.

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Also, Chapter House didn't "win", you don't decide legal cases based on how many judgements went their way numerically.

The decisions fudementally destroyed CHs business, they're no longer allowed to use GW terms to sell their products and they're not allowed to make versions of GW models like the Tau walker, Kroxigor and the eldar models they made.

The fact that they're able to sell their shoulder pads isn't that impressive a victory really.

[Mr Mystery]

They've rebranded literally a handful of stores, to see what happens.

It's commonly called the Warhammer Shop anyways. This is hardly some rushed, whole chain rebranding is it?

[Path Walker]

Careful their Mystery, thats dangerously close to suggesting GW are doing some market research which we all know GW never do...

[sebigboss79]

GW is going to win strengthened and indeed defined IP rights.

Nope. They had to lay down their IP in front of a judge. I find that pretty limiting because anything OUTSIDE those definitions needs to be claimed before it is theirs. In the meantime anyone can stay just outside that big book of IP and not only be within their rights but screw GW without GW being able to say or do anything about it. Not exactly a win but then again some people shoot themselves in the foot claiming it was for the better.

That's priceless right there. Means should they wish to go after any other mickey takers, they're coming from a far stronger position, and said companies would be less likely to get any pro-bono help, leaving them screwed royally, and all because they couldn't be arsed to come up with their own IP.

What is priceless is that GW still has to sue each mickey taker individually who can declare bancruptcy and the story continues under a new name. Does the name Don Quixote and windmills mean anything to you? Does not appear to be the case.

Not sure why people seem to struggle with that?

Maybe because it is nonsense?

And is there really that much bad sentiment? Echo chamber of the internet seems to think so, but my gaming circle are laughing at CH for being dim enough to think they'd actually get away with this.

As for hiding cash? Slightly paranoid much? Accounts exist. If they plead poverty, accounts would be examined. If they've cooked the books, it would be apparent, so on top of this sort of trouble, they might also be faced with tax evasion and fraud charges.

Nonsense again. I can take as much cash out of MY account as I like. If any judge asks me what I spend it on it would be booze and birds. Nothing you can jail me for. As long as I pay my taxes and I took out my money before the court proceedings started, nothing you can do, period.

As for "your gaming circle" ... pretty much non-representative.

But by all means, continue to labour under the misapprehension that GW had any choice in this matter.

No need to labour. A letter from GW to CHS would have costed less than 5 $ and strengthens their legal position a lot more than a bunch of lawyers that claims such letter exists but cannot produce it. Pretty bad performance themselves, eh? But continue to believe the party, sorry GW, is always right.

There is always bancruptcy to get away from paying damages. Not perfect or pretty but even if CHS did pay the damages, GW has sunk more money and the products will resurface with another frontface. Mission accomplished -NOT.

Therefore: Don't fight the enemy, control them.

As for the rebranding: Clear lines, eh? Why the namechange then? I seriously suggest looking at rebranding before claiming companies do not change names to get rid of bad smell attached to the old name. The problem there is the stench is not attached to the name but to the management and I do not see any change in personnel or attitude there.

And more importantly: Are you suggesting the brand is not in trouble and not loosing sales? That might be a case of account doctoring then. Personally I guess the (legal!) "accounts management" was not enough anymore and the loss in sales is now visible even to Ray Charles but to each their own piece of reality.

As another user said: It surely is fun to watch.

[Mr Mystery]

Dude. You are a private individual. You are not a business.

If you're not aware of the legal financial standings involved therein, I'm sorry to say I find the rest of argument inherently flawed.

Again - rebranding is limited to a handful of stores. But by all means, call that molehill a mountain. I'm sure it will eventually stick....

[Eldar_Atog]

There could be something else going on in the background. If they were planning on selling the IP, rebranding a few stores is a good test. It shows that the IP is sellable without the name recognition of the parent company. I'm a little doubtful about this theory but it is possible.


At my company, a re-org/rename after failure is common. If a group takes too long to hit their milestones or causes a production issue, you can bet that the group will be renamed in the near future. A good example of this is the disappearance of a lot of BP branded gas stations in the southern US. After the oil spill, you spotted less and less BP stations. In my area, most of them changed to Shell stations. They still have the same owners and sell the same gas but the BP brand name was killing their business. Once they changed their names, business went back to normal after a few weeks.

About the only reason to do a rebranding when things are going good is if you want to create a logo. Fedex changing their name from Federal Express is a good example of this.

[sebigboss79]

Dude. You are a private individual. You are not a business.

If you're not aware of the legal financial standings involved therein, I'm sorry to say I find the rest of argument inherently flawed.

Again - rebranding is limited to a handful of stores. But by all means, call that molehill a mountain. I'm sure it will eventually stick....

Dude. I can be private individual WHILE running a usiness but the entities need to be separated. Actually the point is not about entity but about knowledge, knowledge you should acquire in ANY basic business study. Concerning my study results AND your post I have little doubt who is ignorant of the inherent dynamics but for the fun of it let us ask again why I would change my name if all is well.

And : I AM a business

The rebranding is in 3 stores to see whether it has a positive influence on sales. So please enlighten me why I would change my business name when all is perfectly OK. And please further enlighten me why I would change my name and invest into telling people that this is my new business (to maintain my brilliant sales) if my business was doing great. IF my business was doing so great I would not waste that money. I would not change the brand but would continue to capitalize on it.

IF my business was going downhill on the other hand...

[Eldar_Atog]

So please enlighten me why I would change my business name when all is perfectly OK. And please further enlighten me why I would change my name and invest into telling people that this is my new business (to maintain my brilliant sales) if my business was doing great. If my business was doing so great I would not waste that money. I would not change the brand but would continue to capitalize on it.

As I said above:

About the only reason to do a rebranding when things are going good is if you want to create a logo. Fedex changing their name from Federal Express is a good example of this.

Do not discount the creation of a company/business logo. A bag, cup, box with your company logo is free advertising. When you first start a business, you probably can't afford to invest in a logo. It's only later.. after you are established that you can do something like that.

You might also find that you violated someone else's copyright (similiar name, etc). Your business is doing well but you have to change the name or be sued.

Or perhaps this:

There could be something else going on in the background. If they were planning on selling the IP, rebranding a few stores is a good test. It shows that the IP is sellable without the name recognition of the parent company. I'm a little doubtful about this theory but it is possible.

[sebigboss79]

Actually this was not aimed at you but again same question to you: Why change my logo?

Only makes sense if the old logo is attached to a certain stench (see the BP example you made).

In case of potential copyright violations you do not testrun the change, you change or you get sued - as you said. You would also drumroll about this change and give the reasons and as the GW Edinburgh said "we are known as the warhammer store" ...sounds a bit feeble as an excuse I am afraid. There is rumours of buyout every now and then but to be earnest who would buy them? The only realistic candidate is Hasbro.

Concerning Hasbro: Why would they buy a company that has this kind of omage in public? Again GW is perfectly right to stop CHS from what they are doing, the magic word here is image. Why are there people even with remote sympathy for CHS? Why can they find a pro-bono defense? Because GW handled this matter very clumsy, thats all.

So please in all fairness, take this matter at what it is: GW grabbing one straw at a time to change the turn of sales which are going down for years. Raising prices by 15% and gaining 1% in sales is NOT positive. It says you are loosing customers left and right. Thats the problem, and thats why they testrun a namechange.

[Eldar_Atog]

Actually this was not aimed at you but again same question to you: Why change my logo?

The Fedex logo change I mentioned would be a good example. They were doing ok business wise as Federal Express but they wanted a cleaner, crisper logo. The new logo is easier to read on planes, trucks, and packages than the old title. It's also protects the company name and makes it unique. Much like the name change for the Imperial Guard.

If your company expands it's services, a name change might be required. I could see small resturants doing this to better indicate what is on the menu.

There are reasons to do it when times are good. I will say that there are a lot more reason to do it during a death spiral though.