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  1. #71

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    Wow, CoffeeGrunt... when was the last time you paid for something with cash? Halfpennies haven't been legal tender since 1984...

  2. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Houghten View Post
    Wow, CoffeeGrunt... when was the last time you paid for something with cash? Halfpennies haven't been legal tender since 1984...
    Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, so I'm gunna note that I meant 1 and 2p coins.
    Read the above in a Tachikoma voice.

  3. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    You speak entirely for yourself there. Especially when it comes to conversions, y'know, those personal touches that shows that it's *your* model that *you* built instead of just another piece off the assembly line. Plastic is easier to cut, easier to discern detail in the unpainted stage, and in the worst case scenario if it gets dropped, the metal won't bend and send any decorative bits you might have added shooting off in random directions.
    But skillfully converted metal models are far more impressive do to the degree of difficulty involved.
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  4. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by 40kGamer View Post
    But skillfully converted metal models are far more impressive do to the degree of difficulty involved.
    Just seems like an unnecessary waste of effort. And saws. And pin drills.
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  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40kGamer View Post
    But skillfully converted metal models are far more impressive do to the degree of difficulty involved.
    not really, merely a different skill set, one where you often waste vast amounts of material in the process for small parts
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  6. #76
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    It's not like you would ever know it was a metal model or not unless you picked it up. Has nothing to do with the skill of the conversion, just with how much frustration the converter was willing to put up with.
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  7. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkLink View Post
    It's not like you would ever know it was a metal model or not unless you picked it up. Has nothing to do with the skill of the conversion, just with how much frustration the converter was willing to put up with.
    I fear I am once again agreeing with DLk. argh! Also, the metal miniature is probably a slightly smaller scale than the rest of the plastic ones around it
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  8. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    Just seems like an unnecessary waste of effort. And saws. And pin drills.
    My biggest complaint was always slightly crisped fingers. Metal heats up like crazy when you hit it with the dremel! I end up using saws, pin drills and more on the plastic models too.

    Quote Originally Posted by daboarder View Post
    not really, merely a different skill set, one where you often waste vast amounts of material in the process for small parts
    Plastic 'conversions' are so common and easy that they are better described as kitbashs vs conversions. Plus the metal isn't wasted as you can always save up all the cast off materials to be repurposed in the forge. More often then not the plastic cast off is just garbage.

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkLink View Post
    It's not like you would ever know it was a metal model or not unless you picked it up. Has nothing to do with the skill of the conversion, just with how much frustration the converter was willing to put up with.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfshade View Post
    I fear I am once again agreeing with DLk. argh! Also, the metal miniature is probably a slightly smaller scale than the rest of the plastic ones around it
    Don't know mates. Maybe I haven't fully embraced the new plastic dogma but I still firmly believe that plastic does not equal the overall quality of metal or resin. Maybe it will soon but it's not there just yet. Especially when you get out of GW land and venture into other brands.

    And on the issue of time... plastic is the poster child for eating time. To try and match the detail quality of metal and resin plastic models come in a billion pieces, create mold lines that are just as bad to deal with as those on metal/resin and if the kits are not properly created they require lots of energy to fix the design flaws.. (here's to you drop pod... you suck!) And if you get warped plastic you are completely screwed as it takes far more energy to reshape.
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  9. #79

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    Sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with all of these.
    Quote Originally Posted by 40kGamer View Post
    My biggest complaint was always slightly crisped fingers. Metal heats up like crazy when you hit it with the dremel! I end up using saws, pin drills and more on the plastic models too.
    Yes, but my saws and pin drills can be re-used after more than one plastic model.

    Plastic 'conversions' are so common and easy that they are better described as kitbashs vs conversions. Plus the metal isn't wasted as you can always save up all the cast off materials to be repurposed in the forge. More often then not the plastic cast off is just garbage.
    That's a very double standard, and doesn't take into account custom sculpting or scratch-build additions. Also, who has a forge and casting tools sitting around handy? And plastic scrap is not wasted; put it in a small glass jar, dissolve it in plastic cement, and it makes an excellent gap-filler putty.

    Don't know mates. Maybe I haven't fully embraced the new plastic dogma but I still firmly believe that plastic does not equal the overall quality of metal or resin. Maybe it will soon but it's not there just yet. Especially when you get out of GW land and venture into other brands.
    Maybe I got an unusually bad run of metals, but I have never understood this "metal has better detail" argument. I've never seen it. Between rough surface texture obliterating fine details, misshapen casts, and poor alignment, plastic has always been my preferred material for crisp detail.

    And on the issue of time... plastic is the poster child for eating time. To try and match the detail quality of metal and resin plastic models come in a billion pieces, create mold lines that are just as bad to deal with as those on metal/resin and if the kits are not properly created they require lots of energy to fix the design flaws.. (here's to you drop pod... you suck!) And if you get warped plastic you are completely screwed as it takes far more energy to reshape.
    I completely agree the drop pod sucks, however, I don't agree on which one takes more time and energy-- having to get the dremel out every time vs. a quick trim with the hobby knife as parts come off the sprue, plastic seems to win out. And trying to scrape down a misaligned piece of plastic to where it's even vs. a misaligned chunk of metal, there's no contest there, plastic wins again.
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  10. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    Sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with all of these.
    No worries mate! Life would be far too boring without differing opinions!

    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    Yes, but my saws and pin drills can be re-used after more than one plastic model.
    Metal does degrade tools a bit faster although buying diamond tipped industrial grade tools vs the ‘hobby grade’ tools we typically use does help with this. I’ve never ran the numbers but I would guess that it costs more to work in metal.

    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    That's a very double standard, and doesn't take into account custom sculpting or scratch-build additions.
    Very much depends on where a person draws the line on conversions. As you mentioned custom sculpting and scratch built parts are definite conversions but both are just as easily worked into metal, resin or plastic. I was in thinking of what people label ‘conversions’ that amount to gluing different parts onto the model or simple repositioning parts.

    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    Also, who has a forge and casting tools sitting around handy? And plastic scrap is not wasted; put it in a small glass jar, dissolve it in plastic cement, and it makes an excellent gap-filler putty.
    Fair enough. I consider access to some form of casting equipment either through ownership or outsourced contract to be essential to the hobby but I realize I am very much an outlier on this topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    Maybe I got an unusually bad run of metals, but I have never understood this "metal has better detail" argument. I've never seen it. Between rough surface texture obliterating fine details, misshapen casts, and poor alignment, plastic has always been my preferred material for crisp detail.
    Metals (and resin) are both heavily dependent on human interaction. People have to properly maintain the molds and it takes a person with skill to run the casting equipment. This can (and does) lead to some really bad metal/resin products. Plus the metal quality and the impurities in a particular batch are also important. If you go outside of GW there is a far larger gap in metal to plastic quality. Take these SYW 28mm historical figures sculpted by the very talented Richard Ansell. I haven’t seen anything comparable in plastic that matches this quality.



    Also the Perry twins have an extensive range of metal/plastic where the metal sculpts are arguably more robust and detailed.

    Quote Originally Posted by DWest View Post
    I completely agree the drop pod sucks, however, I don't agree on which one takes more time and energy-- having to get the dremel out every time vs. a quick trim with the hobby knife as parts come off the sprue, plastic seems to win out. And trying to scrape down a misaligned piece of plastic to where it's even vs. a misaligned chunk of metal, there's no contest there, plastic wins again.
    Metal is quite useless for large models. I have the original WFB giant that weighs an easy 4 lbs! more of a weapon then a model... Resin is the only large kit alternative to plastic worth considering and since it suffers from being brittle I agree that plastic is most often the preferable medium. There is a significant time difference though. Assembling a FW Baneblade takes a fraction of the time required by the newer plastic one.
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