Sisters of Battle - Drop Pod Army

[Charistoph]

But p120 changes that and specifically states that Dedicated transports have the same Battlefield Role as the unit it is bought for.
A Razorback bought as a dedicated transport for a Tactical squad is has the Troops Battlefield Role as per p120.
Are we talking about something different?

I'm talking about something different. Until every codex is brought up to 7th Edition standards, either by codex update or by FAQ, there are units that are literally under the Battlefield Role of Dedicated Transport. No standard, Role-based detachment provides an opening for them, so in a Battle-Forged list, they must be purchased by another unit, just as in days of old.

However, in an Unbound list, this is not necessarily so, as only Formations get to keep their full list and advantages. No Role-based Detachment is effective, so one is free to purchase units from the Dedicated Transport Role list just like any other unit.

Also the Other Battlefield Role is not at all supposed to carry everything not otherwise listed. It specifies that the publication will have the rules for it's Battlefield Role.

Actually it is, and it usually does. Units in the Dedicated Transports Role, when using a Role-based Detachment FOC, can only be purchased AS a Dedicated Transport for another unit. So no other explanation is really needed.

[JMichael]

I think the terminology is important.
The only Battlefield Roles a unit can be are listed on p119 unless otherwise specified in a different book 'Other' (i.e. Imperial Knights).
Since there is no Dedicated Transport Battlefield Role on p119, it does not exist. Indeed they gain the role of the unit bought for. So a Rhino can have the Battlefield Role of one of the following, HQ, Troops, Elites, Fast Attack, Heavy Support, or Lords of War.

Unbound is a different beast all together.

[Charistoph]

I think the terminology is important.
The only Battlefield Roles a unit can be are listed on p119 unless otherwise specified in a different book 'Other' (i.e. Imperial Knights).
Since there is no Dedicated Transport Battlefield Role on p119, it does not exist. Indeed they gain the role of the unit bought for. So a Rhino can have the Battlefield Role of one of the following, HQ, Troops, Elites, Fast Attack, Heavy Support, or Lords of War.

Unbound is a different beast all together.

And Unbound is the point we are talking about in regards to this. The rulebook itself states that it doesn't have every Role that may be used, which is why they included the "Other".

[Gleipnir]

Imperial Knights and Units only listed as Dedicated Transports in a 5th and 6th edition codex would be a perfect example of Other.

As you have been saying though Dedicated Transports would be eligible for selection in any Unbound list as an Other which is essentially a category to cover battlefield roles not otherwise provided for in 7th(as Dedicated Transport is no longer specified as a battlefield role in 7th, where it was in 6th)

7th edition has changed the Dedicated Transports battlefield role to instead be a rule related to selecting transport vehicles as a part of a units upgrade options where the the battlefield role becomes the same as the unit selecting the transport for scoring purposes.

So in an Unbound list yes you could select Drop Pods as an Other and load them with Sisters, though the Drop Pods would be Other(if selected from the previous Dedicated Transports battlefield role) or Fast Attack from Blood Angels and Space Wolves for scoring purposes.

[badbuzz]

I agree with all the quotes from the rules on dedicated transports, reserves and deep strike, and that they mean that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

However, the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 also says "After the game begins, it can then transport any friendly Infantry unit".

Since you always arrive from reserve after the game begins, this means that a unit can arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

To me, the first and second sentences of the final paragraph of the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 appear to contradict one another, and clearly say both that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport, and also that it can.

[Gleipnir]

I agree with all the quotes from the rules on dedicated transports, reserves and deep strike, and that they mean that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

However, the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 also says "After the game begins, it can then transport any friendly Infantry unit".

Since you always arrive from reserve after the game begins, this means that a unit can arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

To me, the first and second sentences of the final paragraph of the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 appear to contradict one another, and clearly say both that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport, and also that it can.

The rules for how units are placed in Deep Strike Reserve as is required for Drop Pods and since this is done before the game turns begin as a part of setup, no you would not be able to place them in Drop Pods outside of an Unbound choice or as Fast attack option selected from an allied Space Wolf or Blood Angels faction list, and again in both instances the Drop Pod would not be considered a Dedicated Transport as they are not provided as an upgrade option for Battle Sisters in their unit entry so would not change their battlefield role as such.

7th Edition has essentially removed the Dedicated Transport battlefield role of 6th and earlier editions and replaced it with a rule for what makes a transport vehicle a dedicated transport(ie a transport vehicle selected as an upgrade option in the unit entry which conveys the same battlefield role on the transport as the unit it is selected to transport)

[Charistoph]

I agree with all the quotes from the rules on dedicated transports, reserves and deep strike, and that they mean that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

However, the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 also says "After the game begins, it can then transport any friendly Infantry unit".

Since you always arrive from reserve after the game begins, this means that a unit can arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport.

To me, the first and second sentences of the final paragraph of the dedicated transports rule on RB pg 82 appear to contradict one another, and clearly say both that a unit can't arrive from reserve in another units dedicated transport, and also that it can.

That's because there is nothing that allows you to change what unit is Embarked on a Transport in Reserves. In fact, as a kind of precedent, ICs cannot leave or change unit they join in Reserves until they arrive on the board. Nor is there a mechanic for a unit to Embark on or Disembark from a Transport while in Reserves once the game has begun.

So, no, a Sisters unit cannot just swap out with a Tactical Squad's Drop Pod while they are in Reserve, unless you can provide a counter to what I just presented.

[Gleipnir]

That's because there is nothing that allows you to change what unit is Embarked on a Transport in Reserves. In fact, as a kind of precedent, ICs cannot leave or change unit they join in Reserves until they arrive on the board. Nor is there a mechanic for a unit to Embark on or Disembark from a Transport while in Reserves once the game has begun.

So, no, a Sisters unit cannot just swap out with a Tactical Squad's Drop Pod while they are in Reserve, unless you can provide a counter to what I just presented.

Yeah definitely can't swap anything out while in reserves, outflank, deep strike or otherwise if you have designated they are loaded in a vehicle during deployment. Though you are welcome to load your sisters into an empty Drop immobile drop pod sitting on the battlefield after the fact if you wanted.

[jeffersonian000]

Sisters use once had a Drop Pod formation back in 2nd Ed, via a Citadel Journal article back when the first Drop Pod model came out. Unfortunately, 3rd Ed saw the Sisters change from "IG with SM equipment" to the Faith powered Battle Nuns we all know and love!

Thankfully, Blood Angels and Sisters share a lot of similar units ... and BA have Drop Pods.

SJ

[badbuzz]

But you don't need to change what unit is embarked while in reserve because there is no rule requiring a dedicated transport placed in reserve to be carrying the unit it was selected with.

That limitation on units embarked on dedicated transports on RB pg 82 only applies "when it is deployed". The preparing reserves rule on RB pg 135 says "players can choose not to deploy some of their units, keeping them as reserves", which defines units which are placed in reserve as not being deployed, so the limitation does not apply.

RB pg 135, Combining Reserve Units, says "you must specify if any units in Reserve are embarked upon any Transport vehicles in Reserve, in which case they will arrive together." Since you can specify if ANY units are embarked on ANY vehicles, once vehicles and units are in reserve you can specify any combination you like.

I do agree that once you have specified a combination you are stuck with it and can't swap or disembark.