Craftworld Eldar in the rumormill

[Defenestratus]

EDIT: You know what def, shut up, seriously most of us commiserated with you over the obvious flaws in the old book.

You dont then get to turn around and attack us when we point out the equally bad balance issues in this book. ESPECIALLY when those balance issues are external.

Calm down man, your being overly belligerent here.




This is probably my biggest issue, because some of us, I hate to inform you are stuck on the **** side of this god aweful abomination of an arms race that GW is shoveling, and we have to put up with their **** and your **** as well so you might not realise but as bad as you think Cron, Marine and Knight players can be, the rest of us are sitting here in "Bad Guy" land thinking you're behaving the EXACT SAME WAY.

Dude.. I'm not angry or belligerent... You'd know it if I was angry. I'm more excited than anything else.

As for me "behaving the exact same way"... I have 12 wave serpents, 6 wraithknights, 4 Avatars, 2 Phantoms, 3 revenants, 5 lynx, 2 scorpions, 2 cobras, 2 warp hunters, a wraithseer and a partridge in a pear freakin tree man. If I wanted to be a power gaming d-bag and just ruin people's good times, I certainly had the arsenal to do it before this codex. I don't need a book that has D-weapons in it, since I had plenty to play with before this. I'm excited now that I can make a take-all-comers list now with models that I haven't used since probably 2006. Thinks like Vypers, and Swooping Hawks, and dark reapers, and nightspinners. Things that might have been ok, but were seriously outshined by other things in the book.

One thing I've never been accused of is being a powergamer. In fact, when I went to the new-to-me LGS in town, I was openly mocked in public by "that guy" for NOT taking 6 wave serpents and 3 wraithknights.

So much this. Eldar players might rejoice that they're the new OP hotness to counter Necrons, but people who play Dark Eldar, Chaos, Dark Angels, Nids etc. are being screwed by both power-creep and the people who accept it because "yay, my army is amazing now!" We end up being called "trolls" and "overly negative" by the positivity brigade, just because we want a bit more game balance.

Well if the trend of Necrons, Skitaii and Eldar continue, you have a lot to look forwards to. If I had to put my finger on the pulse of GW, its certainly that this isn't the same game we've all been playing for the past couple years. I'd imagine that we're going to see more codexes like Necrons and Eldar. What has really excited me is that things that haven't changed since 3rd edition, like Exarch statlines, all of a sudden are getting updated. Its an exciting time to be a 40k player I think since you really don't know what is going to come down the road. I look forward to see what they do for Dark Angels - I'm thinking that we'l see some crazy plasma shenanigans.

And just to be clear.. I'm not rejoicing that I think we're the OP hotness. I'm rejoicing in the fact that I'm going to the bottom of my Eldar bits bin and digging out pewter models to toss in the simple green bath to repaint because all of a sudden, I won't feel like I'm a doormat for using them.

[ShadowcatX]

To everyone saying "this codex is broken" I'm curious. How many codices have you said that about before, because I seem to recall hearing it very often. As recent as the last necron codex in fact. And yet, necrons haven't taken over the meta. This is not the end of 40k as we know it. Take a deep breath, everything will be ok.

This book has problems. We all see it. We may disagree on the degree, but they are there. But you know what? Play testing will prove how much of a problem this really is better than all the theory crafting in the world. Will this be OP on the Severn Loth / Grey knight Centurion Star level? On the 5 flyrant and some spores level? On the 18 wraiths with RP level? We don't know. We all think we know, and we all want our voice heard, we're passionate about our game, we have limited funds, limited time, and we're afraid of the unknown. Its natural. But we can make it known. In a few weeks, we'll have a lot more data with which to judgek in a month, even more.

One other thing, you all are so caught up on what the Eldar can do, you haven't noticed what we can't do. We have pants anti-air without spending 420 points on a formation. We lack good, long ranged anti-tank outside of our LoW. (It is a LoW, right?) We are not going to have numbers on our side, bikes may be the best troops choice in the game, but they are also probably the most expensive this side of terminators r crisis suits, each life is precious. Be aggressive, bring the fight to us, play to the mission. The Eldar are unquestionably powerful, but they are not all powerful.

[daboarder]

To everyone saying "this codex is broken" I'm curious. How many codices have you said that about before, because I seem to recall hearing it very often. As recent as the last necron codex in fact. And yet, necrons haven't taken over the meta. This is not the end of 40k as we know it. Take a deep breath, everything will be ok.

This book has problems. We all see it. We may disagree on the degree, but they are there. But you know what? Play testing will prove how much of a problem this really is better than all the theory crafting in the world. Will this be OP on the Severn Loth / Grey knight Centurion Star level? On the 5 flyrant and some spores level? On the 18 wraiths with RP level? We don't know. We all think we know, and we all want our voice heard, we're passionate about our game, we have limited funds, limited time, and we're afraid of the unknown. Its natural. But we can make it known. In a few weeks, we'll have a lot more data with which to judgek in a month, even more.

One other thing, you all are so caught up on what the Eldar can do, you haven't noticed what we can't do. We have pants anti-air without spending 420 points on a formation. We lack good, long ranged anti-tank outside of our LoW. (It is a LoW, right?) We are not going to have numbers on our side, bikes may be the best troops choice in the game, but they are also probably the most expensive this side of terminators r crisis suits, each life is precious. Be aggressive, bring the fight to us, play to the mission. The Eldar are unquestionably powerful, but they are not all powerful.

List of "broken" Codexes (and the issues with each that we're identified as soon as we had info on them)

Tau 6th ed: Riptides, Missile Sides
Space Wolves 5th ed: Thunderwolves, Grey hunters, Longfangs
Blood Angels 5th ed: Razorback spam
Necrons 5th ed: Night scythe spam
Eldar (really every edition but we'll limit it to 6th): wraithknights, waveserpents,
Space Marines 6th ed: Grav guns, Bikes
Knights: Knights (then ad lance came along)
Chaos Daemons 6th ed: FMC spam (The intermediate flamers would count too)


You'll notice its consitently the same armies time and again that break the "GW is trying to BALANCE the game this cycle..." every single time.

[Defenestratus]

One other thing, you all are so caught up on what the Eldar can do, you haven't noticed what we can't do. We have pants anti-air without spending 420 points on a formation. We lack good, long ranged anti-tank outside of our LoW. (It is a LoW, right?) We are not going to have numbers on our side, bikes may be the best troops choice in the game, but they are also probably the most expensive this side of terminators r crisis suits, each life is precious. Be aggressive, bring the fight to us, play to the mission. The Eldar are unquestionably powerful, but they are not all powerful.

Well there's the swooping hawk thing, but actually being able to fly over a flyer is going to be tough in practice I think, even if you have an 18" move. Plus I haven't seen it confirmed whether its just 1 haywire attack on the flyover or 1 per model. If people take the warhost (and they should because if you don't then thats not really in the spirit of the book) then you're going to be paying at least 350-400 points on the required units - so just bear that in mind when running the numbers.

Here's the first thing I pulled out of mothballs (literally, it was in a cedar trunk lined with mothballs) full of models that I need to rebase and slap some new paint on because I'm actually going to use them now!!!!!!

[Deadlift]

I'm going to say it "is Matt Ward back ?"

[Defenestratus]

List of "broken" Codexes (and the issues with each that we're identified as soon as we had info on them)

Tau 6th ed: Riptides, Missile Sides
Space Wolves 5th ed: Thunderwolves, Grey hunters, Longfangs
Blood Angels 5th ed: Razorback spam
Necrons 5th ed: Night scythe spam
Eldar (really every edition but we'll limit it to 6th): wraithknights, waveserpents,
Space Marines 6th ed: Grav guns, Bikes
Knights: Knights (then ad lance came along)
Chaos Daemons 6th ed: FMC spam (The intermediate flamers would count too)


You'll notice its consitently the same armies time and again that break the "GW is trying to BALANCE the game this cycle..." every single time.

Just a minor correction, the 4th edition Eldar book was rather tame in 5th edition when SMF was no longer a thing and falcons began their heretofore journey of dust collectors.

[ShadowcatX]

List of "broken" Codexes (and the issues with each that we're identified as soon as we had info on them)

Tau 6th ed: Riptides, Missile Sides
Space Wolves 5th ed: Thunderwolves, Grey hunters, Longfangs
Blood Angels 5th ed: Razorback spam
Necrons 5th ed: Night scythe spam
Eldar (really every edition but we'll limit it to 6th): wraithknights, waveserpents,
Space Marines 6th ed: Grav guns, Bikes
Knights: Knights (then ad lance came along)
Chaos Daemons 6th ed: FMC spam (The intermediate flamers would count too)


You'll notice its consitently the same armies time and again that break the "GW is trying to BALANCE the game this cycle..." every single time.

Ok. Is the fear that orks and angry marines are getting left behnd with the eldar codex or is the fear the necrons, tyranid, and space marines are getting left behind? Those are very different levels of broken.

[daboarder]

Just a minor correction, the 4th edition Eldar book was rather tame in 5th edition when SMF was no longer a thing and falcons began their heretofore journey of dust collectors.

sure, but compared to its contemporaries and the style of codexes released at the time it dropped it had more power, options and tricks than anything released before it (and yeah I'm talking about from when GW started striping down the books)

[DarkLink]

For the record, I think the only other time I thought a new release was op was the crazy tzeentch flamer screamer release. Even stuff like the tau or the current eldar was "good, but not unmabageable".

[ShadowcatX]

Well there's the swooping hawk thing, but actually being able to fly over a flyer is going to be tough in practice I think, even if you have an 18" move. Plus I haven't seen it confirmed whether its just 1 haywire attack on the flyover or 1 per model. If people take the warhost (and they should because if you don't then thats not really in the spirit of the book)

I'm not sure how good that will be, 2/3rds of the scary flyer armies seem to be wound based flyers.

Also, the whole battle host, I'm not sure what that is really in the spirit of except footdar. (Although footdar with wraithblades with axes sounds like a blast.)