New Space Marine Codex Rumor Roundup

[Houghten]

So thats the reason why we do not see any White Scar armies at top tables and everything is littered with Ravenwing because of all their valid "options"

You're so far outside the original point that I'm just going to post a picture of a chick in a mitre:


Because it has exactly as much to do with the "vanilla SM are stealing all DA's cool stuff" gripe as "Ravenwing aren't winning tournaments" does.

[Kirsten]

roflcopters

[Mr Mystery]

So thats the reason why we do not see any White Scar armies at top tables and everything is littered with Ravenwing because of all their valid "options"

I don't know. I don't really follow tournaments, as I'm much too obsessed with just having some fun.

[Tomgar]

vanilla bike armies, you have bikes, attack bikes, and land speeders. ravenwing armies you have bikes, ravenwing knights, command squad, attack bikes, land speeders, land speeder vengeance, land speeder darkshroud.
vanilla terminator armies you have tactical or assault terminators. dark angels get deathwing terminators, command squads, and deathwing knights.

vanilla marines being able to take terminator or bike armies in no way takes away from the uniqueness of dark angels terminator or bike armies.

So because we get a couple more options (at vastly inflated costs that render said options almost useless), we should be fine with vanilla marines suddenly having the turn 1 alpha striking termie armies or all bike armies that were once one of our own unique game mechanics?

Umm, no. Just no.

[Kirsten]

a lot more options actually, as you can see. and terminator armies and bike armies have been available to marines for a long time.

so yes. just yes.

I would like to put forward a totally radical suggestion. how about you wait until the marine and dark angels books actually come out before throwing the toys out of the pram?

[Tomgar]

Yup.

Deathwing are a reliable unit, and can carry a proper mix of weapons, making each squad that much more efficient, even if you go 4 x THSS and 1 x Assault Cannon - it's still better than Vanilla Marines will ever get.

Yes, Deathwing are very reliable at being overcosted as hell because Fearless. And you're really not seeing my point: a few different weapon options doesn't make up for the fact that our general playstyles and mechanics have now been made available to Vanillas on top of all their own crap. Drone on about THSS and Heavy Weapon Deathwing all you like, it still doesn't change the fact that the once unique Deathwing alpha strike mechanic has now become a standard Vanilla tactic.

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a lot more options actually, as you can see. and terminator armies and bike armies have been available to marines for a long time.

so yes. just yes.

I would like to put forward a totally radical suggestion. how about you wait until the marine and dark angels books actually come out before throwing the toys out of the pram?

I see no toys on the floor, I'm only discussing my feelings on what we currently know about the Vanilla book and making educated guesses about the next DA book. Hardly tantrum throwing. But hey, guess I'm not being all sunshine and rainbows about everything GW does so that means I'm just throwing a childish hissy fit, eh? Oh, and Vanillas now get bike command squads, I'm led to believe. So much for those unique DA options!

[Kirsten]

your last few posts have been nothing but whining about something when you have no actual knowledge of what the new books will be like. so yes, it is tantrum throwing. wait until the dark angels codex comes out before *****ing about what marines can get or do.

[Mr Mystery]

I think you're vastly underestimating Fearless Terminators.....go on. Shift them off that objective. It's doable, but can you really afford to chuck that much firepower at them when there's the rest of their army shooting you up?

But as Kirsten says - don't worry about hypotheticals. That's the Ultramarine way, and not befitting a son of Caliban.

[Kirsten]

vanilla terminators are coming down in cost apparently, I bet the deathwing will too. and we know the dark angels will get new formations, because everyone has done. for all you know the deathwing formation will be far better than the vanilla marine one. at which point your better terminators, with more units and more options, and a better formation, will be sitting pretty.

[Defenestratus]

if you are taking a full company some free transports are hardly going to break the game.

11 deathwind missile drop pods might put a hurt on though. I doubt people are going to run out and buy a crapton more drop pods just to do it, but its a viable tactic.

But overall, I see a fluffy codex if not an overly powerful one. The Land Raider formation SOUNDS great until you realize that you can just still hullpoint the things to death and the vehicle squadrons lose their special rules if you blow up just a single tank. If you go second, and turn one a predator blows up, well, sorry - you didn't get to use that rule...