Bodies Over Bullets

[Fueldrop]

Is it possible to create a list containing more models than it is possible to kill in a 5 round game?

Let's set some parameters:
both sides are 1,500 points.
All rolling is assumed to conform to the law of averages (EG BS3 hits 50% of the time)
Blasts hit 3 targets/shot. Large Blasts hit 6 targets/shot. Templates hit 5 targets/shot. It's assumed that sometimes you hit more, sometimes you hit less, but it averages around there for this experiment.
All non-template weapons can be fired every round. Template weapons can be fired from the second round onwards (exception: flyers come in on the second round).
Due to the fickle nature of maneuvering, we will assume the worst and say that only enemy units get to assault the army, not the other way around.
Any netlist can be used for opposition.

Alternatively, assume 400 casualties inflicted (80 kills per round, doable with some lists)

For the sake of making things easy we will ignore morale for now. We will also assume that the army was trained by the Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy, and graduated with full honours (IE the enemy army takes no casualties).

Can it be done? Can a game be won by sheer dint of having too many men for your enemy to stop you?

[Mr Mystery]

Would have to be an army made of extremely rubbish troops, like Grots or Imperial Guard conscripts.

But you know, it actually sounds like a fun game for a one off.

I've played stacked games akin to it before, where one side is horribly outnumbered, but only loses if there's a total wipe out of their forces. One sticks in mind from 2nd Ed at my local store. IG v Nids in a starship troopers assault type game.

Bro and I were sensible, and stashed a single squad survivor in some very dense cover, winning the game through some tricksy cunning. The game was otherwise a complete blast! Not something I'd care to do regularly like, but definitely an event game!

[Tyrendian]

funny and sorta relevant: a Guardsmen on Guardsmen shooting gallery would not do it in five turns (assuming more than 12" distance), because every turn a Guardsman will kill 1/2*1/2*2/3=1/6 of a Guardsman (BS3 chance to hit * S3 vs T3 chance to wound * chance to get through 5+ save) with his flashlight (results using a fleshlight may vary)

[Tokunator]

I am currently building an Imperial Armour 13 Renegades list with 250 bodies in 2000 points, 140 of which return on a 5+ when killed, as well as 15 Sentinels with autocannons and some Rapier Laser Destroyers. Few people can remove that in a normal game. Heck, Draigostar builds just run away crying as gravguns do jack against this.

[Denzark]

The short answer is yes. The medium answer is yes, depending what you use. The slightly longer answer is definitely using unbound, depends on what formations in battle forged. The renegade IA13 has multi spawning troop options and zombies with 4+FNP. The new Warhammer World exclusive blood Oath book has a formation that allows respawning Bloodletters on 4+.

Also needs to factor in cover/LoS which skews your mathhammer to the point of irrelevance.

[Fueldrop]

My "mathhammer" was pretty much absolute worst case scenario. Once you start factoring in cover, range, line of sight, and the fact that most armies aren't exactly built for cutting down endless hordes of infantry, sheer numbers becomes a bit of a more workable tactic.

In an objectives-based battle, having a massed horde of objective secured troops can win the game simply by being impossible to clear off all the objectives. Add some token heavy weapons to pop transports and you can kill off any enemies with objective secured through flashlight spam.

Do Imperial Guard still have that special character with "Send In The Next Wave"?

- - - Updated - - -

Additional question: How many conscripts can an imperial knights spam list kill in 5 turns?

[Denzark]

Fueldrop - I think Chenkov has gone. So no next wave. As for Imperial Knights, there are so many variables. lets assume the knights deploy 12" and all the conscripts are cowering on the baseline, so about 30" away. The Knights will get 2 turns shooting before they charge in and start stomping, which will cause most casualties. I would hope they would kill at least 10 per turn per knight shooting if they are bunched up - although if you stick at 1500pts like you said, you are only getting 4 knights. A lot will depend if they have priests or commissars with them - as no one of any sense would run the mass blob without.

If the mass blob is even further forward the carnage would be quicker.

[Fueldrop]

Welp, there goes the plan for tying up the enemy in a neverending wave of conscripts

[Haighus]

Maybe not neverending (I've done it in the past, it was hilarious), but seeing as Conscripts are now 3pts/model, it is only 150pts (175 with Priest/Commissar) for the whole unit, so you can have 2 units per Knight. I think a Knight will struggle to get through 100 Fearless bodies in 5 turns.

Company Command Squad =60pts
Priest x5 =150pts
x5 Meltabombs
Commissar x1 =30pts
x1 Meltabombs

Infantry Platoon =440pts
Platoon Command Squad
Infantry Squad x5
x1 Meltabombs
Conscript Squad (+30 additional Conscripts)

Infantry Platoon =435pts
Platoon Command Squad
Infantry Squad x5
Conscript Squad (+30 additional Conscripts)

Infantry Platoon =385pts
Platoon Command Squad
Infantry Squad x4
Conscript Squad (+30 additional Conscripts)

Total= 1500pts

Has a total of 150 Conscripts, 140 Guardsmen, 6 ICs and 20 men in Command Squads. If you get everything into cover, that will take some removing! I added the smattering of melta because there were points spare and it allows them to harm everything... eventually.

It could essentially place a blob squad onto every objective on the board, and everything has Objective Secured.

[Fueldrop]

This I like. I'm not sure my 1750 list would be able to kill that many models in 5 rounds.