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  1. #1

    Default The Rubric of Ahriman, and loyalist Thousand Sons

    Morning.

    Very quickly....

    So we know at the time of the razing of Prospero, the Thousand Sons were anything but Traitors. Their Primarch was certainly going a bit rogue, but entirely out of loyalty and ignorance of his actions.

    In fact, I don't think it's yet been covered exactly when they threw their lot in with Chaos wholesale.

    Therefore, there could well be covens of loyalist Thousand Sons during the Heresy, just as every Traitor Legion had them.

    My question is simple - do we know if Ahirman's Rubric was Legion wide, or only those with him on the Planet of the Sorcerors at the time of the casting?
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  2. #2
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    I don't think it's ever been specifically stated whether the Rubric affected every Thousand Son everywhere. I've recently re-read the two John French Ahriman books and the flashbacks to the Rubric seem to suggest that it has a focus just on the Planet of the Sorcerers. *

    Ahriman's viewpoint is that it will affect every Thousand Son, IIRC, but both his flashbacks and the subsequent adventures - indeed, his entire world view - is that every Thousand Son was either transported to the Planet of the Sorcerers by Magnus or had been killed by the 'Wolves on Prospero. So he would naturally assume that he would be affecting every Thousand Son, because they were all on the same planet as him and 'in range'

    In the Age of Darkness anthology, the story Rebirth by Chris Wraight deals with some Thousand Sons who were off-planet at the time of the Razing of Prospero and return after its sacking by the Loyalist forces. Unlike the Thousand Sons we see in the latter stages of A Thousand Sons/ Prospero Burns and then in later events on the Planet of the Sorcerers, they aren't suffering the massive genetic breakdown/ sudden onset of mutation into a gribbly thing.

    My (possibly incorrect) logic is that this suggests that the massive genetic breakdown might have been limited to the Thousand Sons who fought on Prospero and were then taken to the Planet of the Sorcerers - i.e. it was the events the latter stages of A Thousand Sons/ Prospero Burns which triggered the final genetic breakdown of the Thousand Sons, and if you were a Thousand Son who wasn't on Prospero at the time, your genetics wouldn't be as unstable and therefore you wouldn't need the Rubric.

    In other words, there could be Loyalist/ Traitor or unaligned Thousand Sons who a) were not on Prospero at the time of its razing; and b) whose genetic stability, for want of a better term, would be at a similar level to Ahriman and co. at the beginning of the A Thousand Sons novel. They might suddenly devolve into mutants one day, but perhaps not, at least for a while.

    Of course, if such marines used their psychic powers too much and/or ventured into the Eye of Terror or similarly unstable space, then the rapid genetic breakdown might kick in and they'd wish that they had been subject to the Rubric after all.

    This is all speculation, of course. I think one of the later Heresy hardbacks from Forge World (I think it's IV) suggest that there were isolated Loyalist groups from all of the Legions which sided with Horus, and similarly there were isolated Traitor groups from all of the Legions which stayed loyal. But that's a throwaway sentence IIRC, in that it doesn't go into much detail nor does it list specific examples.


    * Caveat I am writing this having had very little sleep due to a major work deadline so it is possible that the first sentence of Ahriman: Exile is actually "And then Ahzek cried, 'Shazam!' and the Rubric travelled to every Thousand Son in the universe" and I've missed it.
    Last edited by JamesP; 12-11-2015 at 06:18 PM.

  3. #3

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    That sir, is not only a bloody good answer, but a pretty comprehensive one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mystery View Post
    That sir, is not only a bloody good answer, but a pretty comprehensive one.

    I award you 12,000 internets as a reward. Use them wisely.
    Thank you, I will use them to bribe Forgeworld to bring back my favourite Thousand Son, Brother-Captain Karlsen, who used to pop up in Epic battle reports and I think in a short background piece where he was going through his memories of the last 10,000 years and deciding what to keep and what to erase.

  5. #5

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    My interpretation of it has always been that the genetic flaw in the 1k sons was similar to the flaw in the canis helix, or the red thirst or the way the Emperors Children just can't pass a mirror without stopping. They devolved on a mass scale following the transportation to the planet of sorcerers; I assume being in the eye of terror was what did it. The warp kind of has that effect on things.

    As to loyalty, I think Ahriman still thinks he's on the right side, whatever that may be now. I think Magnus acted out of loyalty all the way, till he messed up and sold his soul to save his sons. I'd say its quite possible that at the time of the razing there were plenty of other loyalist 1ksons out in the galaxy, who knows what became of them?

  6. #6

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    Well, as I recall, the Blood Ravens are rumored to be descended from a branch of the Thousand Sons who left Prospero on Magnus' orders prior to the Burning. They're pretty clearly not Rubric'd, although they remain pretty heavy on Psykers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew da Destroya View Post
    Well, as I recall, the Blood Ravens are rumored to be descended from a branch of the Thousand Sons who left Prospero on Magnus' orders prior to the Burning. They're pretty clearly not Rubric'd, although they remain pretty heavy on Psykers.
    Yeah, the Chris Wraight HH story Rebirth hints at the same thing, though in keeping with the Blood Ravens' background nothing is explicitly said.

  8. #8

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    Well done. Just to support your original argument James with a couple of examples of 1kSons beyond the raising of Prospero (005.M31) :

    Mhotep - Fleet Captain (Battle for the Abyss ~007.M31). Did not live for very long, but used all of his powers without signs of flesh-change.

    Atharva - Adeptus Exemptus (The Outcast Dead ~007.M31) Eventually destroyed his psyker talent (!) before his demise, but showed no signs of difficulty with physiology or powers

    I was also going to list Arvida but had not read Rebirth (didn't know he was listed there among the group that was off-world).

  9. #9
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    The Thousand Son and their Primarch were the very definition of Traitors the Emperor ordered them explicitly not to do something and they did it anyway quite spectacularly as it happens. Unleash the Wolves !! Oh right that's already happend.

    Although as noted earlier there are pockets Marines from the other Traitor legions which didn't turn with the rest of their Legions, stands to reason the same could have happend with the 1000 Sons. As to the flesh change wasn't it a very rare occurrence until they actually arrived at the Planet of Sorcerer? Again as mentioned earlier it's like the curse of the wulfen or red thirst but all that chaos increases the issue.
    Last edited by grimmas; 12-15-2015 at 12:46 PM.
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  10. #10

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    I just got done reading Path of Heaven, and it is hinted that use of one's power after the change has started can worsen or hasten the flesh change. When the portal to the webway is opened, Arvida is stricken the pain of the flesh change, but once inside the webway, which is psychically warded, the pain and change ebbs away. Therefore, the warps exacerbates the change. Arvida's change could have be caused by his time on Prospero after its raising and then the use of his powers worsened his condition.

 

 
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