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  1. #351

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cutter View Post
    Verily, the TIE/sf is indeed the Mary Sue of TIE fighters.

    Hyperdrive, deflector shields, rear gunner AND warhead launcher?

    And all in the same convenient form factor, more or less.

    Really, how DID they lose...
    To be fair, it's 30 years on. In that time, we went from Spitfires to Harrier Jump Jets. Given the massive differences in capability between those two things, it's not unfeasible. Especially for an advances society that would, theoretically, have better design ability. If you're using the same chassis it could even be easy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaric View Post
    In leais defense. She did her part. Also, shes old and wisdom is too valuable to waste on what was perceived as a suicide mission.
    I think MM was referring to A New Hope, whereas you're referring to TFA?
    Read the above in a Tachikoma voice.

  2. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mystery View Post
    It's more that she just stood around and looked concerned - we didn't really see what she was doing there.

    It's a shame, as it meant the only thing she did in the third act was dish out the medals.
    I never see my politicians do a damn thing but look pretty for the cameras LOL but they still be doin something...I hope...

    Im amazed they even put the old ones in there as old people seem antithesis to what action movies usually have for a cast. I have hopes that many unexplained things get explained in the next one.


    CG:I was thinking he was talkin bout the newest but its not like I read everything correctly all the time LOL so I could be wrong there

  3. #353
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    had to post this, from an article on famous bootlegs

    Click image for larger version. 

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    too good

  4. #354
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaric View Post
    Im amazed they even put the old ones in there as old people seem antithesis to what action movies usually have for a cast. I have hopes that many unexplained things get explained in the next one.
    lol try to tell that to... uh I dunno... Sylvester Stallone? Bruce Willis? JCVD? Schwarzenegger? Harrison Ford for that matter?
    The bigger they are, the bigger the mess they make when they step on you. - Ahzek Ahriman, on Titans

  5. #355
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrendian View Post
    lol try to tell that to... uh I dunno... Sylvester Stallone? Bruce Willis? JCVD? Schwarzenegger? Harrison Ford for that matter?
    Those are all males. Pls name a woman....and Go ... Oh thats right..Unless u get a movie like RED its pretty rare. Its usually one of the old buggers u mentioned with a younger broad.

    And all of those guys dont sell like they used to in action movies.

  6. #356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alaric View Post
    Those are all males. Pls name a woman....and Go ... Oh thats right..Unless u get a movie like RED its pretty rare. Its usually one of the old buggers u mentioned with a younger broad.

    And all of those guys dont sell like they used to in action movies.
    didn't see you referring to women in your post, on that I do agree.
    The bigger they are, the bigger the mess they make when they step on you. - Ahzek Ahriman, on Titans

  7. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrendian View Post
    didn't see you referring to women in your post, on that I do agree.
    Nø problemo dude. I was replung to MM and u kinda jumped in the middle

  8. #358

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cutter View Post
    Verily, the TIE/sf is indeed the Mary Sue of TIE fighters.

    Hyperdrive, deflector shields, rear gunner AND warhead launcher?

    And all in the same convenient form factor, more or less.

    Really, how DID they lose...
    The "sf" stands for "Special Forces." It wasn't the backbone of their fleet. The TIE/fo was, which was basically just an updated TIE Fighter.

    They might have had some TIE/sf's on SKB, but it's likely more expensive to keep in the air, so they probably only had TIE/fo's patrolling, with the TIE/sf's having to be fueled, armed, and their pilot and gunner both suited up and gotten into the fighter before they could be launched. The action happened relatively quickly, and it's not like they were going to scramble everything when the assumption would have been that the walls could hold (and did, until they got blown up from inside, which is more a failure of the Stormtroopers and Kylo Ren to stop a small team of infiltrators... something that's much easier said than done).

    As it is, they still lost a good bit of their equipment on SKB because they didn't assume they'd have to actually get it in the air that quickly. The TIE's closest to being ready to launch would have been getting airborne, but once they realized the threat, fueling operations (forget armaments) would have switched to transports (assuming they weren't focused on that to start with... Hux seemed to think SKB wasn't going to last any kind of attack) in order to help the evacuation. Equipment can be replaced easier than personnel, especially in a military that kidnaps children and then indoctrinates them as it raises them to become soldiers once they get to 18 or older. They'd have to snatch more kids and wait for them to grow up. No, it's easier and probably cheaper (given the cost of years of living expenses for the new recruits) to replace gear.

    At the end of the day, they lost because they didn't expect a small attack to be a real threat (and were surprised by having ships bouncing out of hyperspace way too close to a hefty source of gravity), and it only was because the ground team was able to bring the shields down without using their explosives and then was able to sneak past the Stormtroopers patrolling the place (or kill them or knock them out) in order to place enough explosives to blow a hole from the inside so an X-Wing could get inside and start unloading its laser cannons. The plan worked pretty much on sheer luck, highly improbably but it worked out in the end.

  9. #359

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mystery View Post
    Just thinking more about the Finn as Comedy Goof thing, and I've gone off on a bit of a tangent, but not massively tangential as tangents go....

    He is this series Luke. Han remains Han, and Rey has taken over as Leia.

    Think about it. The only one not really knowing what they were doing in A New Hope was Luke.

    Han was the seasoned adventurer - confident in his own abilities, and knows when and how to push his luck. He's got loyalty and muscle in Chewie to boot, and a total awesome space ship.

    Leia? So much more 'with it' than Luke. Consider her lines and her actions. She squares up to Vader and Tarkin, almost arrogantly so (this is arguably shown to be a front when they target Alderaan). She gives Luke a hard time when he first enters the cell, seemingly resigned to her fate but determined not to appear scared (she may or may not have been terrified, it's not really covered. She certainly never shows fear for her situation). She gets them out of the Detention Block, rips into Han's ship (you came in that thing? You're braver than I thought) quickly becomes the one taking charge and proves the best shot of the lot of them just before the swing to safety. (oddly I think its these early interactions with Han that sparks the attraction for him. The dude is clearly a rogue, and has just met a not unattractive young lady who is having absolutely none of it because she's far too busy having all the best ideas and saving the lives of the three doofuses who somehow managed not to get killed to that point. Speaking for myself, I find women who aren't having any of my tomfoolery incredibly attractive)

    Luke? He's dreamed of adventure his entire life. All he's wanted to do is get away from Tattooine and be a hero for something somewhere. Suddenly gets his wish, finds out everyone is far better at Heroing than he is. (make for a decent character arc as well)

    Rey? Much closer to Leia than Luke. She's learned to look out for number one and not just take it if she doesn't have to (see Unkar's thugs getting a righteous kicking, then chasing down and beating up Finn thinking he was a thief. It seems clear the only reason she takes it from Unkar is a total lack of choice. His position isn't necessarily unassailable, but she's not well placed to buck the trend - she's got to eat, after all)

    Finn? So far, he's our Luke. So out of his depth it's not even funny, but still incredibly brave, and willing to fight for others even though he has relatively little reason to.

    Addendum

    For what its worth, I think its a real shame that Leia remained on Yavin IV during the Death Star assault. She went from confident leader to 'well, I'll just stand around with my thumb up my posterior whilst everyone else risks their lives'. I don't think she'd have quite convinced as also an Ace Pilot (other opinions are available and just as valid), but I'd love to have seen her overseeing the evacuation - it would have been a chance to see her leadership skills and position of respect before Empire Strikes Back. But relatively minor quibble.
    I thought of Finn as more of a young Han Solo, sort of when Han would have been starting his rogue career. Went AWOL from his forced military life, wanted nothing more than to get away and do his own thing. Met a girl, chased her for a bit, eventually joined her in her quest, was goofy etc etc.

    Han had his goofy moments as well in the first film. IIRC Han was also ex-military wasn't he? Same kind of rogue template. Both started out looking out for themselves and ended up joining a cause for the Greater Good. (now if only the Tau had X-wings...)

    And Leia, you just don't risk what she brings to the table on random suicide missions. She's far more valuable to the cause running the show from a secure-ish base. Plus she's kinda the Frontman for the Resistance at this point, and in chess, you only commit your king (or in this case Princess) to battle under the very direst of circumstances.

    And Rey. Rey is her own thing I think. You can definitely see a bit of Leia, Han and Luke in her character type, but I believe she's her own iteration of hero. Strong, fearless, independent and even has a vulnerable side. I think she will end up being a seriously kick-*** hero that makes all the others look like chumps.
    na na na na na... wut?

  10. #360
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