Age of Sigmar SCGT pack v 1.1

[Broxus]

Heya all AoS fans,

I didn't see a thread for this so thought I would share the SCGT pack (largest AoS tournament to date) with everyone to use in your own games. I would compare this to being somewhere in the middle of Clash Comp and the SDK system in terms of points/rules/missions. Hopefully, this will give new players more options to balance and play there games. The pool choices are now also on scroll builder: [url]http://www.scrollbuilder.com[/url] so you can enjoy building lists in days past. I would highly recommend checking it out!


BATTLE PLANS AND MISSIONS:
[url]http://www.heelanhammer.com/SCGTdownloads/SCGT16BatPlanV1.01.pdf[/url]

HOUSE RULES AND FAQ:
[url]http://www.heelanhammer.com/SCGTdownloads/SCGT16RulesFAQV1.01.pdf[/url]

POOL CHOICES: [url]http://www.heelanhammer.com/SCGTdownloads/SCGT16PoolV1.pdf[/url]


All feedback and error reporting should be sent to:
[email][email protected][/email]

[malisteen]

I like the look of the battle plans, though some of the themes to them are a little odd where they reference the outside influence of models that may be physically on the table (I'm thinking specifically of Nagash laughing maniacally as he sends his night haunts to punch himself in the face).

I feel Clash handles summoning better, and the event rules could be improved by adopting the same policy. Instead of designating a specific 'summoning pool', and especially instead of getting freebie points for doing so, if a player wants to summon stuff, then they should just deploy X few pool points at the start of the game, and then during the game they can summon X pool points chosen freely from the undeployed models in their total army.

This is quicker and easier than having specific units, and doesn't give the summoning player freebie points - which are unnecessary - and further would eliminate the need for bonus points given to destruction factions playing off against summoners. Better and more streamlined all around.

At first glance, I like the pool values assigned to the various units. Zombies should be a core unit for vamp counts, but I've already sent an email about that, and apparently it's already queued for the next update.

[Broxus]

I really like the summoning in this pack. It gives some risk vs reward. It makes no sense in other packs to not start with everything on the board. I am not sure if you saw destruction gets extra pool choices automatically when playing an army that summons in this pack. I think this strikes the perfect balance for summoning. However, it's all personal opinion.

I like the missions and pool choices also and do know that some things will likely need to be tweaked.

[malisteen]

I really like the summoning in this pack. It gives some risk vs reward. It makes no sense in other packs to not start with everything on the board. I am not sure if you saw destruction gets extra pool choices automatically when playing an army that summons in this pack. I think this strikes the perfect balance for summoning. However, it's all personal opinion.

Summoning already gives you a unit appearing where and when you want, instantly responding to the opponents' field position, untargetable before it appears. It gives you a banshee or terrorgheist suddenly appearing in scream range without the opponent having any opportunity to shoot them before they start screaming. It gives you a blocking unit of saurus cutting off an opponent's flanking maneuver for a turn, without you having to accurately guess during deployment what flank the enemy army was going to deploy their fast monster or cavalry unit on. It lets your fast flying daemon prince scoot up a flank and start conjuring supporting units behind the enemy battle line to go after squishy units in the back.

There are plenty of reasons to still use summoning even when it isn't giving you 'free stuff', and the fact that the rules writers for this system felt Destruction needed extra points when opponents are using summoning is a tacit admission that said 'free stuff' isn't balanced. And if it isn't balanced playing against non-summoning destruction armies, then it isn't balanced against non-summoning order or chaos or death armies either.

Summoning shouldn't get you 'free stuff'. It doesn't need to, there are still cases where it's good to use even when it doesn't get you 'free stuff', it's always unbalanced when it does. I have seen more games of sigmar ruined by this than anything else, and feel very strongly about it.

[Broxus]

Summoning unrestricted is game breaking. However, under this system it's still very restricted. It's all a matter of opinion and neither of us have played it under this system. I us recommend doing some play testing and submitting feedback.

- - - Updated - - -

I played the first mission in the pack tonight. Wow, what a fun mission and was my best game of AoS so far. I had no summoning so I can't comment on that aspect.

[malisteen]

Summoning 'a little' free stuff is less broken than summoning 'a lot' of free stuff sure, but it's still more broken than just not giving summoners free stuff when there's no reason to do so. This system is not far removed from the 'a wizard can only summon one extra unit' restriction, which I have played with, and that was still broken. if the summoning pool were balanced on its own, the extra points for destruction when playing against summoning would be unnecessary. If not, then it should be fixed in a way that such a patch isn't necessary, especially when that patch doesn't even fix it in all cases, only against non-summoning armies from a particular grand alliance.

[Broxus]

This is really a muted down version of summoning. You can't just summon anything you want on the table you need the points. There is quite a bit of risk of being dispelled, killed, or failing your cast roles before you even summon your points back.

I would recommend as I stated earlier testing it out, noting your results, then submitting your findings to the email address. I'm willing to bet you will find its not as bad as you think, but neither of us can speak from experience yet.

[Auticus]

what i have found with azyr and summoning is that you'll never get a consensus on what summoning should do. I had about 50 emails thrown my way that were all different on how to handle it. No matter what direction you take, someone will say it sucks.

[malisteen]

In that case, you might be better just banning summoning from your events. Nothing at all needs it to function.

[Auticus]

While I would definitely be in favor for heavy handed restrictions on summoning (I hate summoning in both 40k and aos) - that would cause a riot with the few people left playing here.