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  1. #1

    Default Voice of Command must Go!

    This special rule for the Astra Militarum must be scrapped, or all other armies must be allowed to use it, because it is distorting the whole aspect of the game. I have just witnessed an Astra Militarum "mob" of conscripts throw 148 dice, then 128 dice, while the "stupid" Orks just looked on. Apparently, only Humans are intelligent enough to understand the whole concept of command and giving orders, whilst the equally intelligent or more intelligent races such as Aeldari haven┤t thought of this military concept yet!┤

    This rule allows mobs of humans to run around (even conscripts) and wipe out everything on the table. I could understand it if a small unit of elite troops, such as snipers could use this order, say 5 figures, but not all of the infantry in mobs of 50 figures. It distorts the whole Astra Militarum army because their infantry is too cheap and can go around in units of 50, whereas other armies are expensive and limited to either 10, or 20 in number.

    Surely, we want to pit our wits against the other player, by out-thinking him on a tactical or strategic level and not simply by taking a biased army. Also, it may be mathematically impossible to beat an Astra Militarum army, because there are not enough turns in the game and not enough powerful weapons can be brought to bear on the infantry mobs. For example. to destroy a mob of 50 Conscripts, you would have to wipe out 9 every turn, at least, and by the third turn at most, they are upon you and engaged in hand to hand combat, from which they can run away when the going gets tough and fire at you into the bargain.

    Let┤s sort out this distortion now.
    Last edited by Dave the Walrus; 09-04-2017 at 01:42 AM.

  2. #2

    Default

    Conscripts are the problem, rather than the rule voice of command.

    Conscripts shouldnt get the same benefits from the voice of command or from commissars as a standard unit (the impact of a commissar should be a lot more than just one model for failing a morale test, that change would make a big difference.

    Plus I have built a repulsor that with the auras I will have on it can inflict (on average) 24 wounds in a turn at 24", thats just one unit, admittedly an expensive one, but that unit was built with mobs of models in mind, and other units / armies will have that effect too.

    Add in the Heavy Bolters & bolt weapons I have (with the same auras), I reckon I can flatten a 50 man unit of conscripts in a turn, so its all about how you play your army and how well it can adapt to the different targets.

    I dont think they need to lose the ability to give an order, but they do need to change their impact on conscripts.

  3. #3

    Default

    I agree that conscripts are the main problem, but how if we split the Astra Militarum into 3 units of 20, rather than 1 unit of 50. These 3 units could form a platoon structure. 3 units of 20 would be much easier for the
    opponent to beat, but would still confer all of the benefits to the Astra. One other idea would be to restore having to dice throw against Leadership.

  4. #4

    Default

    *Starts giving out butt-sized band-aids*

    Imperial Guard have always been able to dish out that kind of volume of fire -- when a 50-man squad (conscripts or regulars) is firing at something within 12" and is given the specific order that allows them to fire one additional shot. You're look at an average of 147~150 shots fired, of which half are statistically suppose to hit and on average only a quarter of that will actually wound. It's just how it's always been. Some players utilize this potential within the Guard, other players do not.

    Best to just avoid charging too close to such blobs before first shelling them from afar.
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  5. #5

    Default

    I suspect that the meta of the game will start to include some sniper rifles/Vindicare assassins in a lot of armies to pop those pesky Commissars. That should dampen their fun.

    Also, a humble rhino grinding away at a conscript mob will tie them up, sometimes for a whole battle. You may not defeat them, but first rank fire won't work in the fight phase.
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  6. #6

    Default

    Whose seen the new codex yet ? Broken as F .

  7. #7

    Default

    Dude, don't mean to be rude but your reaction is a little bit typical of people when each new codex and Edition comes out. So you get a blobby scrum of conscripts pumping out a massive volume of shots. All you needed to do was look at what they were there for. Because if that was his force Majour then he is in trouble. Some one mentioned the conscript blob to me a couple of days ago and I worked out the beating of it almost immediately. And now it's even worse for the Guard because the Commissar inflicts more casualties and does your job for you. I'm talking about the compulsory re-roll morale test with the obligatory execution.

    In my case that is a Serpent full of Wraithguard D-Scythes. Sit back at 14" for his turn of shooting, that way even with VoC it is only 100 shots from lasguns at the Serpent. They got to hit on 5's wound on 6 and I get to save and possibly ignore. I may lose a couple of wounds but I am going to hit back with so much more. Come my turn I dismount 6 WG 3" forward of the Serpent. I move 6" which puts my scythes in range. My Serpent moves to the flank. I then shoot with my D-Scythes, (don't want to whittle away my targets), D3 shots lets say 2 each, (You roll 1 die for the group), that's 12 auto hits at S10 which means at least 10 wounds. Add the Serpent shots of missiles or Shuriken Cannon and the SC underneath. At least 5 more wounds out of a possible 9 to 15 shots. Then assault with the D-Scythes weathering OverWatch, 70 shots hit on 6 S3 against T6, 3+ Sv and W3 per model. To be honest I expect at least 4 get in. Then say 4 S5 attacks = say 3 more wounds, so that is 18 wounds all up. Then he attacks back with 35 Guardsmen hitting on 5+, S3 v T6 if all of them can get close enough. I don't expect the Commissar to be able to get base to base so he don't hit. So the guardsmen say kill another one. Morale tests happen, WG pass, 3 + 6 is not enough to cause casualties. The Conscripts already lose, 18 + D6 say a 4. But it's failed so the Commissar kills 1 and they re-roll, its an even bet it could be better or worse. But lets go with a roll of 3. That is 18 men + 3 = 21 - 8Ld (No counting the commissar kill), that's another 13 Conscripts down. In one round he just lost 32 Conscripts. It could go a lot worse or much better. And now it's his turn what does he do?

    - - - Updated - - -

    What have Orks got to do this kind of thing? Dreads, Kanz, Mega armour, battle wagons, Jump boys, burna boys and so on.

    Really, a blob of 50 conscripts with flash lights should not hurt that much because you can see them being deployed and there is no way they can all be in cover.

  8. #8
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    Default

    I guess with conscripts/commissars being hit with a double nerf bat this argument is now nugatory.
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