Backlash attacks in multiple combats?

[TSINI]

Alright dudes,

got a little question for you, i'm sorry if its already been covered

this occured in a quick 1500 point game last night, thought it would be good to shine a light under it.


The situation

I managed to get a unit of hormagaunts into combat with an eldar Wraithlord (to bog it down until my combat oriented hive tyrant could get there) they obviously couldn't hurt the damn thing.

The turn after, a unit of ripper swarms enter combat, as well as the hive tyrant.

After some shoddy hive tyrant rolling the wraithlord decides to attack the ripper swarms, causing 2 wounds - these cause instant death and so inflict 6 wounds over 2 bases.

because the hormagaunts, rippers, and Hive Tyrant are all fearless and have lost the combat they remain locked in combat and take 6 wounds each with armour saves (the hive tyrant lost 3 of its 4 wounds)

Are we playing this correct?

I realise the FAQ shows that you have to attack the first unit into combat (in this case the hormagaunts)

Page 41 – Multiple Combats, Attacking.
A third bullet point should be added, as follows:
• Models that at the beginning of the combat (before any
model attacked) were engaged with more than one enemy
unit, but were in base contact with just one of the enemy
units, must attack that unit.

But even in this situation, the hive tyrant will be taking easy hits from the wraithlord without being the subject of the assault (hit the easy to wound targets - injure the harder stuff without having to pierce their armour)

And as using the hormagaunts to hold down targets until the big stuff gets involved will be a commont tactic for myself, i thought i better get this ruling correctly understood

so to summarise in a fluffy manner:

The mighty Hive Tyrant screeched into the combat with an ear-peircing scream, its mighty scythes swishing in great arcs which the nimble ancient eldar battle suit easily dodged, dancing in circles around the wall of slashing talons. with a swift move of his mighty Eldar sword swathes of lesser rippers were destroyed in a briliant display of gore and ichor. the hive tyrant seemingly beside itself with dispair at the loss of its insignificant brethren, decides to slash at itself in a furious attempt to end its life. The Wraithlord is confused, but triumphant.

In actual fact, the wraithlord did not survive the combat after some hive tyrant attacks finally land, but the tyrant was beyond repair having lost 3 wounds to a character that wasnt even attacking him.

Help me Bols lounge goers, you're my Hive tyrant's only hope!

TSINI

[Nungunz]

I managed to get a unit of hormagaunts into combat with an eldar Wraithlord (to bog it down until my combat oriented hive tyrant could get there) they obviously couldn't hurt the damn thing.

Take Toxin Sacs, then you can easily hurt and kill it.

[B]because the hormagaunts, rippers, and Hive Tyrant are all fearless and have lost the combat they remain locked in combat and take 6 wounds each with armour saves (the hive tyrant lost 3 of its 4 wounds)

Unfortunately this is correct, though assigning attacks may have been abused.

I realise the FAQ shows that you have to attack the first unit into combat (in this case the hormagaunts)

Not quite. I'll analyze this later when I have the rulebook next to me.

And as using the hormagaunts to hold down targets until the big stuff gets involved will be a commont tactic for myself, i thought i better get this ruling correctly understood

As I said before, give them toxin sacs and they can easily bring down MCs.

[Bean]

Unfortunately, TSINI, you guys did play it correctly. The Hive Tyrant does take combat resolution wounds from being fearless even if all the casualties your side takes are from rippers or gaunts.

The solution is just to be cautious about getting your Tyrants and Trygons and whatnot into multiple-combats alongside gaunts and rippers.

[Calypso2ts]

The FAQ actually is trying to say you can attack any enemy you are engaged with in the assault phase, whether you became engaged in the current assault phase or the previous assault phase.

You are indeed playing this correctly, I would have attacked the ripper swarm as well to try and throw fearless saves onto the rest as well. What I really like to do is throw a hammer unit into some gaunts and cause 15 or 20 wounds on them while pulling a nearby monstrous creature into the combat with a single model in base with it.

I think better fluff would be...

The wraithbone construct stood strong in the face of the encroaching tyranid biomass. It set upon them with an eerily silent ferocity, a balanced counterpoint to the screeching gaunts. The creatures fell before it, as it shrugged off their blows and hurled the teeming masses back onto themselves. Its jeweled eyes seemed to laugh as it saw the Tyranid royalty coaxing his subjects into a frenzied assault that trampled him asunder...

[TSINI]

Cheers guys, that really is a nasty ruling

I'll definately have to rethink how to get my lumbering beasts into combat with fast moving foe.


after flicking through the rulebook it turns out the "attacking the unit/s you were in contact with last round before new units" rule was already in the rulebook

and i figured i had got confused about the FAQ ruling (slow brain day)

cheers for the clarification, not that i doubted my opponent of course

[ForsakenImp]

Q: For multiple combats there are two extra rules under
the heading ‘Attacking’. For these rules, at what point is “at
the beginning of the combat”? (p41)
A: It is after defenders react when you pick the combat but
before any attacks have been rolled.

Actually, you don't have to attack whoever you were in combat with last time. This rule clarifies that the rule is mentioning a time after attackers are move in, so you can attack anyone you were in combat with before you actually roll dice. Not exactly sure how someone moves after that, but this GW faq specifically clarifies that this is indeed the correct timing.

The rule is to make sure that if you have model a touching only one unit and model b touching an second unit, model a can't attack the second unit using the 2" rule- it has to attack the unit it was touching.

[Valourousheart]

How did you fit your tyrant and rippers into base contact with the wrath lord in the second round of CC?

At the end of the first round of combat (the one with just the guants), you would have had to pile in to get everyone in base contact... which means that you would have had a ring of guants around that WL.