Archon & Djinn blade

[GrenAcid]

Hi, on other forum there wehe question about Djinn blade, dose it grants you +2A with PW and your stats or it grants +2A to weapon you use??

Im after first option cuz for me its a "dancing" blade, that just attack alongside with you.

[Nabterayl]

The Djin Blade itself is the weapon you use, so it gives you the power weapon ability and its special +2A. It's not a floating blade. But even if it was, it's a weapon, so it doesn't do anything unless you're "using" it.

[Necron_Lord]

Let's say that you have an Archon with an Agonizer, Djin Blade and a Splinter Pistol. If you used the Splinter Pistol and Agonizer your Archon would be A 4/5 and wound on a 4+ and ignore armor saves. If you used the Djin Blade and the Splinter Pistol your Archon would be A 4/5 +2 and have a power weapon at the Archon's strength but two dice would be rolled seperate because something unfortuitous can happen if a double is rolled for the extra attacks. You can't use two different special weapons at the same time. The only other CC weapon one can use with an Agonizer or Djin Blade would be a normal CC weapon or a pistol.

[GrenAcid]

Its not a weapon like agoniser, I cant buy 2 djinn blades cuz its special wargear....not wepon option, I can have 2 ccw and djinn blade, question is how those +2A works.

[yrdetraxe]

It IS a weapon! It even says so in the description:

"A djin blade is a power weapon. Furthermore the bearer makes two bonus attacks ...."

No need to argue about that.

[Necron_Lord]

Its not a weapon like agoniser, I cant buy 2 djinn blades cuz its special wargear....not wepon option, I can have 2 ccw and djinn blade, question is how those +2A works.

Let's say you use the Djin Blade in CC. You would get 5 power weapon attacks (Djin Blade + either Pistol or CC Weapon) and then 2 additional Power Weapon attacks which you need to roll separately or use a different color dice. If the to hit rolls for the two additional attacks are doubles (i.e. they are both '1's, '2's, etc.) then those 2 attacks hit the Archon and then you have to roll to wound against him. Otherwise you would then roll to wound against the enemy for all hits made. All damage would be at the Archon's strength and ignore armor saves.

[Squirrelking]

I'd like to play devil's advocate here. If I can =)

Djinn blade's rules say two very distinct things:

1) A djin blade is a power weapon.
2) Furthermore the bearer makes two bonus attacks

RAW is saying it is wargear that is a power weapon. It also says that this wargear then gives you 2 bonus attacks. It does not specify that those bonus attacks are PW attacks, that would be RAI. I feel what confuses the issue is that if you roll doubles then "the blade rebels against its wielder" thus supposing that it's the Djinn blade making those attacks.

A non confusing rule write up would be: "the djinn blade is a power weapon. Furthermore, the bearer makes two bonus power weapon attacks at the users strength." A rule like the old servo-harness for Iron Warriors that specified what kind of bonus attack it got (i.e. +1 powerfist attack).

You could see it like the old Chaos Gift Daemonic Mutation that gave you +1 attack. It didn't specify what kind of attack it was. Just that it gives you +1 attack.

I am purposefully avoiding playing with the Djinn blade because of this. I think that it gives the user 2 bonus attacks, to be used as the user wishes. I also think that it is a power weapon and can be used that way too. But I know others don't see it that way, so I'm not pushing for an argument.

A little bit like the "straight line" thing with Reavers.

[Duo Sonata]

I would say that you'd have to be using the Djinn blade in order to gain it's two bonus attacks and not just have it equipped. The GK FAQ supports this since if you have the GK Daemon weapons which also have some abilities that say "Bearer" or "Wielder" instead of just "When using" and yet you have to choose between which two you want to use to gain their respective bonuses.

[Necron_Lord]

I'd like to play devil's advocate here. If I can =)

Djinn blade's rules say two very distinct things:

1) A djin blade is a power weapon.
2) Furthermore the bearer makes two bonus attacks

RAW is saying it is wargear that is a power weapon. It also says that this wargear then gives you 2 bonus attacks. It does not specify that those bonus attacks are PW attacks, that would be RAI. I feel what confuses the issue is that if you roll doubles then "the blade rebels against its wielder" thus supposing that it's the Djinn blade making those attacks.

In the BRB (p. 42) it states that when one is using a special weapon and normal weapon in CC "All of the attacks, including the bonus attack, use the special weapon's bonuses and penalties". Since the special weapon (Djin Blade) is the one granting the additional attacks, they would be power weapon attacks like the bonus attack from the CC weapon or pistol, even though normally a CC weapon or pistol attack would not ignore armor saves in CC. I personally don't think there is an issue. Just mi dos centavos.

[isotope99]

Even if this was true, would you really pay for an agoniser and a djinn blade just to add 1 attack (you lose the 2CC one for having two special weapons) that could hurt you?