Dred's bending bullets?

[w7west]

Happened to me a few weeks ago in a game against one of the guys at my LGS. I let him take the shot but I definitely was not pleased with the physics behind this situation.

Not sure if this pic will work but here:



If image does not show, here is the photobucket link:

[url]http://i672.photobucket.com/albums/vv86/w7west/situation.png[/url]


So basically what is going on here is that his autocannon dred (polygon + double lines for autocannon) is shooting at my raider (triangle), over a rhino (rectangle).

The red line represents the arc of sight that is blocked from my raider to the dred. Only things above this line would be able to see the raider. As you can see, the ends of his autocannons are protruding above this line due to rare earth magnets letting him pivot the arms vertically.

My problem with this was that although the barrels were indeed not blocked by the rhino, they were clearly pointing in a trajectory that would sail far above my raider.

Does the weapon need to be aligned with it's target in the vertical plane in order to shoot?

If so, the autocannons would need to fall below the red line in the diagram, meaning they would not have line of sight.

If not, would you be ok with someone who models his autocannons sticking at an extreme angle, perhaps even 90 degrees taking shots dead ahead?

Thanks guys, hope the image works.

[Slug]

Line of sight must be traced from the eyes of the model to any part of the body of at least one of the models in the target unit (to compress, as in no decorative pieces like banners or wings.)

That's page 16 left hand column, paragraph two, first three line and a summary of the rest of Check Line of Sight and Pick a Target.

So therefore the shooting model has to be able to physically see what it is shooting at not just have a part of the shooting model in LOS. So in your case the dread would have to have the sarcophagus/head actually in line of sight, I can't actually tell if this is the case for your situation, but it seems not. So you were right in that he shouldn't have been able shoot, though this is regardless of whether the guns can or cant get a barring on your unit.

[Multigeneral]

page 58, little rulebook, under "Vehicle weapons and line of sight"

"When firing a vehicles weapons, piont them against the target and then trace the line of sight from each weapons mounting and along its barrel, to see if the shot is blocked by terrain or models." This exact statement is also on page 72 under "Walkers Shooting". So no not a legal shot as the the line of sight, if traced properly according to the rules, would have been blocked by the rhino. Politely ask this guy to read his rulebook.

[AngelsofDeath]

If it sounds like BS and looks like BS....then its BS. Like it says "True line of sight" This guy must have been trying to milk it for all it was worth.

Just wondering what army was he playing?

[Xenith]

As before, vehicle LOS is determines by looking down the length of the barrel, in this case, the barrel is pointing up in the air and he can shoot nothing.

Incidentally, this rule means that the SoB exorcist can shoot nothing. Ever.

[SotonShades]

Incidentally, this rule means that the SoB exorcist can shoot nothing. Ever.

Doesn't it use the barrage rules and thus ignores the normal restriction?

[eldargal]

Not in the new rules, it is just Heavy D6. It is one of those situations where a more sensible interpretation of the rules is needed as the missile fire up out of the tube first. Unlike this dreadnought situation where the player basically cheated.

[DrLove42]

Theres a difference between a mortar....and what I'm guessing from the picture is a Psybolt Autocannon rifle

[pathwinder14]

page 58, little rulebook, under "Vehicle weapons and line of sight"

"When firing a vehicles weapons, piont them against the target and then trace the line of sight from each weapons mounting and along its barrel, to see if the shot is blocked by terrain or models." This exact statement is also on page 72 under "Walkers Shooting". So no not a legal shot as the the line of sight, if traced properly according to the rules, would have been blocked by the rhino. Politely ask this guy to read his rulebook.

I second. You are correct sir. No LOS to/from Dread.

[FTE-Charge!!!]

This situation is just plain sad. What is even worse is the frequency that it happens at my LGS.

My store is filled with power gamers, their new shiny codices, and horrible social skills.

The icing on the cake? I get treated like a jerk when I politely reference rules to players pulling TLOS like this! I am the bad guy bc I reference the rules and challenge TLOS maddness like this?! You would think I insulted their mother by the look on their face when I stop their shooting phase to quickly come over and check the LOS from their angle (not that it is needed all of the time). As soon as someone can see the tip top of your helmet.... "game over man, game over"